14 Dec
2011
14 Dec
'11
10:57 p.m.
Since I'm trying to come up with an idea for new [a little more
modern, and not looking like it was made in 2003 (no offense to
creator intended)] Trinity website I'd like some help. What I need is
a logo, a symbol for Trinity. And one that is not religious (since the
name was understood as a religious one once). The current logo is a
no-no IMO since it's a too big reference to the KDE logo (gears) and
it just kde3.5 logo with a "T" instead of "K". It should be something
simple and easy to remember.
I know I might be demanding too much, but I think it's a good idea to
come up with something together.
14 Dec
14 Dec
11:26 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Wed, 14 Dec 2011, L0ner sh4dou wrote:
Since I'm trying to come up with an idea for new [a
little more
modern, and not looking like it was made in 2003 (no offense to
creator intended)] Trinity website I'd like some help. What I need is
a logo, a symbol for Trinity. And one that is not religious (since the
name was understood as a religious one once). The current logo is a
no-no IMO since it's a too big reference to the KDE logo (gears) and
it just kde3.5 logo with a "T" instead of "K". It should be something
simple and easy to remember.
<wry humor>
"Trinity Site is where the first atomic bomb was tested
at 5:29:45 a.m. Mountain War Time on July 16, 1945."
... maybe a Large T overlaying a mushroom cloud.
... signifying 'blowing up' the New Think in desktop environments.
<wry humor/>
Jonesy
11:57 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
> Since I'm trying to come up with an idea for
new [a little more
> modern, and not looking like it was made in 2003 (no offense to
> creator intended)] Trinity website I'd like some help. What I need is
> a logo, a symbol for Trinity. And one that is not religious
In my random googling, there is an old symbol
that has more of a "3" connotation, and not so much
of a religious one. Which I find appealing in the
sense of "timelessness". It's not entirely free
of negative connotations but perhaps worth
considering.
http://paulraspa.wordpress.com/tag/triskele/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triskelion
One broader throught is to lessen the emphasis on
KDE, in favor of the broader notion of the number 3.
- Nigel
15 Dec
15 Dec
12:48 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
Hi all,
I rather like this one:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Triskele-Symbol1.svg
With a little bit of work it could be a rather nice logo.
Best regards
On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 11:57 PM, Nigel Stewart <nigels.com(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
Since I'm trying to come up with an idea for new
[a little more
In my random googling, there is an old symbol
that has more of a "3" connotation, and not so much
of a religious one. Which I find appealing in the
sense of "timelessness". It's not entirely free
of negative connotations but perhaps worth
considering.
http://paulraspa.wordpress.**com/tag/triskele/<http://paulraspa.wordpres…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/**Triskelion<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T…
One broader throught is to lessen the emphasis on
KDE, in favor of the broader notion of the number 3.
- Nigel
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modern,
and not looking like it was made in 2003 (no offense to
creator intended)] Trinity website I'd like some help. What I need is
a logo, a symbol for Trinity. And one that is not religious
1:20 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/15 Tiago Marques <tiagomnm(a)gmail.com>om>:
Hi all,
I rather like this
one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Triskele-Symbol1.svg
With a little bit of work it could be a rather nice logo.
Best regards
+1, yet triskelion seems to be religious too (argh!, could some1
verify?). Yet it seems so unknown to most that I think it will do.
2011/12/15 E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com>
Also, might it perhaps be of
benefit to choose colours different from those favoured by the KDE
project (even if it's just a different blue, like navy or teal)?
I was thinking
about a little more dark blue. Anyway I had some idea
for text-logo: http://db.tt/cpKGVg61 This is the shade of blue i was
thinking about.
2011/12/15 E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com>
Hmmm . . . Maybe something involving a triangle, to
emphasise the
whole "three" notion (which would hopefully connect the word
"trinity"
back to something other than religion)?
I don't think that triangle would do. You know, whole illuminati and
eye that sees thing. See:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eye_of_Providence
If there's no great hurry, I may try my hand at
sketching something
over the next few days . . .
Your sketches will be more than welcome. And there is
no hurry, since
I need to gather my ideas for whole structure of website, not only for
layout.
8:53 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/15 L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com>om>:
2011/12/15 Tiago Marques <tiagomnm(a)gmail.com>om>:
Just an idea for triskele. To prevent this thing from being understood
as a religious one or nazi-something (since triskele was used by nazis
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triskelion#Third_Reich_and_supremacist_uses)
we could change the way in which whole thing "spins".
Hi all,
I rather like this
one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Triskele-Symbol1.svg
With a little bit of work it could be a rather nice logo.
Best regards
+1, yet triskelion seems to be religious too (argh!, could some1
verify?). Yet it seems so unknown to most that I think it will do.
11:02 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/15 L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com>om>:
2011/12/15 L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com>om>:
You got me thinking about whole triselon thing. I did a two litte
sketches for trinity logo proposal.
First: http://db.tt/LwqZWTuP
Second: http://db.tt/YpivoAGk
First one reasembles too much the Reaper logo (http://www.reaper.fm/),
but maybe it's only my impression.
I don't think the second could be used since it's pretty much the same
as logo of Trisquel linux (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trisquel) [I
stumbled on Trisquel by pure coincidence]
2011/12/15 Tiago Marques
<tiagomnm(a)gmail.com>om>:
Just an idea for triskele. To prevent this thing from being understood
as a religious one or nazi-something (since triskele was used by nazis
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triskelion#Third_Reich_and_supremacist_uses)
we could change the way in which whole thing "spins". Hi all,
I rather like this
one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Triskele-Symbol1.svg
With a little bit of work it could be a rather nice logo.
Best regards
+1, yet triskelion seems to be religious too (argh!, could some1
verify?). Yet it seems so unknown to most that I think it will do.
11:21 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
L0ner sh4dou a écrit :
You got me thinking about whole triselon thing. I did
a two litte
sketches for trinity logo proposal.
First: http://db.tt/LwqZWTuP
Second: http://db.tt/YpivoAGk
Maybe the "T" is not that much important and the logo could be designed
without it.
Nicolas
12:14 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/15 Nicolas Bercher <nbercher(a)yahoo.fr>fr>:
L0ner sh4dou a écrit :
If we remove the t from the second one we will just get logo of
Trisquel linux. For the first one it's integral part of logo, without
it the space looks 'empty' to me.
You got me thinking about whole triselon thing. I
did a two litte
sketches for trinity logo proposal.
First: http://db.tt/LwqZWTuP
Second: http://db.tt/YpivoAGk
Maybe the "T" is not that much important and the logo could be designed
without it.
Nicolas
10:02 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 15 December 2011 07:14, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
2011/12/15 Nicolas Bercher <nbercher(a)yahoo.fr>fr>:
I like the first one more than the second (reminds me of the trisequal logo
to much, could be taken as far as a blatant rip off :x)
Does no one like the current trinity logo? I sort of like it actually :)
But if I had to pick it would be the first one.
I like the idea of the Gear. it reminds me of a hard working, well tuned
machine designed for serious activities, rather than a less serious one.
Could you create this as an SVG? I could give it a whack.
Calvin
L0ner sh4dou a écrit :
If we remove the t from the second one we will just get logo of
Trisquel linux. For the first one it's integral part of logo, without
it the space looks 'empty' to me.
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You got me thinking about whole triselon thing. I
did a two litte
sketches for trinity logo proposal.
First: http://db.tt/LwqZWTuP
Second: http://db.tt/YpivoAGk
Maybe the "T" is not that much important and the logo could be designed
without it.
Nicolas
11:01 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/15 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
On 15 December 2011 07:14, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Same opinion here.
2011/12/15 Nicolas Bercher <nbercher(a)yahoo.fr>fr>:
I like the first one more than the second (reminds me of the trisequal logo
to much, could be taken as far as a blatant rip off :x) L0ner sh4dou a écrit :
If we remove the t from the second one we will just get logo of
Trisquel linux. For the first one it's integral part of logo, without
it the space looks 'empty' to me.
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You got me thinking about whole triselon thing. I
did a two litte
sketches for trinity logo proposal.
First: http://db.tt/LwqZWTuP
Second: http://db.tt/YpivoAGk
Maybe the "T" is not that much important and the logo could be designed
without it.
Nicolas
Does no one like the current trinity logo? I sort of like it actually :) But
if I had to pick it would be the first one.
I like the idea of the Gear. it reminds me of a hard working, well tuned
machine designed for serious activities, rather than a less serious one.
Yes, but
this gear is too strong reference to KDE, anyway we can have
a gear-like tooths in the logo (like in second example).
Could you create this as an SVG? I could give it a whack.
Only If I learn how to xD
Anyway I'm more occupied by PKGBUILDs for arch ATM, so I will work on
this after I finish those. This was to gather some ideas, since I want
to create new webpage for trinity at some point (acutally second thing
on my TO-DO list, after PKGBUILDs)
16 Dec
16 Dec
12:02 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 15 December 2011 18:01, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
2011/12/15 Calvin Morrison
<mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
I like the first one more than the second (reminds me of the trisequal logo
Aside from archlinux packages I'm also the defacto website designer, well
sort of.
I developed the current website ( a vast improvement from the previous one
) and it's been quite careful.
We don't want anything to much, or to little, to complicated or to simple.
I think improvments would be more warranted the this scenario.
Calvin Morrison
On 15 December 2011 07:14, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> 2011/12/15 Nicolas Bercher <nbercher(a)yahoo.fr>fr>:
> > L0ner sh4dou a écrit :
> >
> >> You got me thinking about whole triselon thing. I did a two litte
> >> sketches for trinity logo proposal.
> >> First: http://db.tt/LwqZWTuP
> >> Second: http://db.tt/YpivoAGk
> >
> >
> > Maybe the "T" is not that much important and the logo could be
designed
without it.
Nicolas
If we remove the t from the second one we will just get logo of
Trisquel linux. For the first one it's integral part of logo, without
it the space looks 'empty' to me.
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to much, could be taken as far as a blatant rip
off :x)
Same opinion here.
Does no one like the current trinity logo? I sort of like it actually :)
But
if I had to pick it would be the first one.
I like the idea of the Gear. it reminds me of a hard working, well tuned
machine designed for serious activities, rather than a less serious one.
Yes, but
this gear is too strong reference to KDE, anyway we can have
a gear-like tooths in the logo (like in second example).
Could you create this as an SVG? I could give it a whack.
Only If I learn how to xD
Anyway I'm more occupied by PKGBUILDs for arch ATM, so I will work on
this after I finish those. This was to gather some ideas, since I want
to create new webpage for trinity at some point (acutally second thing
on my TO-DO list, after PKGBUILDs)
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12:29 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
On 15 December 2011 18:01, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I was thinking on relaying completely on the wiki system we use for
whole site. It can be done.
And I think we should add some sort of news system in which we will
write what actually happens inside the project, so it don't seem dead.
If we add ability to comment those news it will be like saying to
users "we care about what you think!". User-frendliness. This can be
done by using plugin for the wiki system.
Generally the archlinux site is a great inspiration for me. It's
simple, looks good and has everything you need.
2011/12/15 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
Aside from archlinux packages I'm also the defacto website designer, well
sort of.
I developed the current website ( a vast improvement from the previous one )
and it's been quite careful.
We don't want anything to much, or to little, to complicated or to simple.
I think improvments would be more warranted the this scenario.
On 15 December 2011 07:14, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Same opinion here.
2011/12/15 Nicolas Bercher <nbercher(a)yahoo.fr>fr>:
> L0ner sh4dou a écrit :
>
>> You got me thinking about whole triselon thing. I did a two litte
>> sketches for trinity logo proposal.
>> First: http://db.tt/LwqZWTuP
>> Second: http://db.tt/YpivoAGk
>
>
> Maybe the "T" is not that much important and the logo could be
> designed
> without it.
>
> Nicolas
>
If we remove the t from the second one we will just get logo of
Trisquel linux. For the first one it's integral part of logo, without
it the space looks 'empty' to me.
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I like the first one more than the second (reminds me of the trisequal
logo
to much, could be taken as far as a blatant rip off :x)
Does no one like the current trinity logo? I sort of like it actually :)
But
if I had to pick it would be the first one.
I like the idea of the Gear. it reminds me of a hard working, well tuned
machine designed for serious activities, rather than a less serious one.
Yes, but
this gear is too strong reference to KDE, anyway we can have
a gear-like tooths in the logo (like in second example).
Could you create this as an SVG? I could give it a whack.
Only If I learn how to xD
Anyway I'm more occupied by PKGBUILDs for arch ATM, so I will work on
this after I finish those. This was to gather some ideas, since I want
to create new webpage for trinity at some point (acutally second thing
on my TO-DO list, after PKGBUILDs)
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12:41 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 15 December 2011 19:29, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison
<mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
one )
Indeed it looks great and works well, though I think it is very complicated
(it is hosted in their git repository so you can see)
I'd like to see some things.
A "planet" - basically it's a feed for all of our different blogs into one
page.
A "apps" section, I think Darrell spoke about this before.
In fact, Darrell had a lot of good stuff and ideas for simplifying the
navigation of the website, they're somewhere in the mail logs recently.
I think we are avoiding using any sort of databsases however and we want to
make sure tihs all will render well on any web browser.
Calvin Morrison
On 15 December 2011 18:01, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> 2011/12/15 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
> >
> >
> > On 15 December 2011 07:14, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> 2011/12/15 Nicolas Bercher <nbercher(a)yahoo.fr>fr>:
> >> > L0ner sh4dou a écrit :
> >> >
> >> >> You got me thinking about whole triselon thing. I did a two litte
> >> >> sketches for trinity logo proposal.
> >> >> First: http://db.tt/LwqZWTuP
> >> >> Second: http://db.tt/YpivoAGk
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Maybe the "T" is not that much important and the logo could
be
> >> > designed
> >> > without it.
> >> >
> >> > Nicolas
> >> >
> >> If we remove the t from the second one we will just get logo of
> >> Trisquel linux. For the first one it's integral part of logo, without
> >> it the space looks 'empty' to me.
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> >> trinity-devel-unsubscribe(a)lists.pearsoncomputing.net
> >> For additional commands, e-mail:
> >> trinity-devel-help(a)lists.pearsoncomputing.net
> >> Read list messsages on the Web archive:
> >> http://trinity-devel.pearsoncomputing.net/
> >> Please remember not to top-post:
> >> http://trinity.pearsoncomputing.net/mailing_lists/#top-posting
> >>
> >
> > I like the first one more than the second (reminds me of the trisequal
> > logo
> > to much, could be taken as far as a blatant rip off :x)
> Same opinion here.
>
> >
> > Does no one like the current trinity logo? I sort of like it actually
:)
> > But
> > if I had to pick it would be the first one.
> >
> > I like the idea of the Gear. it reminds me of a hard working, well
tuned
> > machine designed for serious activities,
rather than a less serious
one.
Yes, but
this gear is too strong reference to KDE, anyway we can have
a gear-like tooths in the logo (like in second example).
Aside from archlinux packages I'm also the defacto website designer, well
sort of.
I developed the current website ( a vast improvement from the previous
Could you create this as an SVG? I could give it a whack.
Only If I learn how to xD
Anyway I'm more occupied by PKGBUILDs for arch ATM, so I will work on
this after I finish those. This was to gather some ideas, since I want
to create new webpage for trinity at some point (acutally second thing
on my TO-DO list, after PKGBUILDs)
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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and it's been quite careful.
We don't want anything to much, or to little, to complicated or to
simple.
I think improvments would be more warranted the
this scenario.
I was thinking on relaying completely on the wiki system we use for
whole site. It can be done.
And I think we should add some sort of news system in which we will
write what actually happens inside the project, so it don't seem dead.
If we add ability to comment those news it will be like saying to
users "we care about what you think!". User-frendliness. This can be
done by using plugin for the wiki system.
Generally the archlinux site is a great inspiration for me. It's
simple, looks good and has everything you need.
12:45 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
On 15 December 2011 19:29, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Well I can do some css magic. It will look good and render on modern
browsers (forget about konqueror tho).
Not using databases is a big problem, since it practically constrains
you to use static pages. As I said we could use the wiki system for
everything. I'll try to make a draft after I finish pkgbuilds.
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
Indeed it looks great and works well, though I think it is very complicated
(it is hosted in their git repository so you can see)
I'd like to see some things.
A "planet" - basically it's a feed for all of our different blogs into one
page.
A "apps" section, I think Darrell spoke about this before.
In fact, Darrell had a lot of good stuff and ideas for simplifying the
navigation of the website, they're somewhere in the mail logs recently.
I think we are avoiding using any sort of databsases however and we want to
make sure tihs all will render well on any web browser.
Calvin Morrison
On 15 December 2011 18:01, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I was thinking on relaying completely on the wiki system we use for
whole site. It can be done.
And I think we should add some sort of news system in which we will
write what actually happens inside the project, so it don't seem dead.
If we add ability to comment those news it will be like saying to
users "we care about what you think!". User-frendliness. This can be
done by using plugin for the wiki system.
Generally the archlinux site is a great inspiration for me. It's
simple, looks good and has everything you need.
2011/12/15 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
>
>
> On 15 December 2011 07:14, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> 2011/12/15 Nicolas Bercher <nbercher(a)yahoo.fr>fr>:
>> > L0ner sh4dou a écrit :
>> >
>> >> You got me thinking about whole triselon thing. I did a two litte
>> >> sketches for trinity logo proposal.
>> >> First: http://db.tt/LwqZWTuP
>> >> Second: http://db.tt/YpivoAGk
>> >
>> >
>> > Maybe the "T" is not that much important and the logo could be
>> > designed
>> > without it.
>> >
>> > Nicolas
>> >
>> If we remove the t from the second one we will just get logo of
>> Trisquel linux. For the first one it's integral part of logo,
>> without
>> it the space looks 'empty' to me.
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
>> trinity-devel-unsubscribe(a)lists.pearsoncomputing.net
>> For additional commands, e-mail:
>> trinity-devel-help(a)lists.pearsoncomputing.net
>> Read list messsages on the Web archive:
>> http://trinity-devel.pearsoncomputing.net/
>> Please remember not to top-post:
>> http://trinity.pearsoncomputing.net/mailing_lists/#top-posting
>>
>
> I like the first one more than the second (reminds me of the
> trisequal
> logo
> to much, could be taken as far as a blatant rip off :x)
Same opinion here.
>
> Does no one like the current trinity logo? I sort of like it actually
> :)
> But
> if I had to pick it would be the first one.
>
> I like the idea of the Gear. it reminds me of a hard working, well
> tuned
> machine designed for serious activities, rather than a less serious
> one.
Yes, but this gear is too strong reference to KDE, anyway we can have
a gear-like tooths in the logo (like in second example).
>
> Could you create this as an SVG? I could give it a whack.
>
Only If I learn how to xD
Anyway I'm more occupied by PKGBUILDs for arch ATM, so I will work on
this after I finish those. This was to gather some ideas, since I want
to create new webpage for trinity at some point (acutally second thing
on my TO-DO list, after PKGBUILDs)
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Aside from archlinux packages I'm also the defacto website designer,
well
sort of.
I developed the current website ( a vast improvement from the previous
one )
and it's been quite careful.
We don't want anything to much, or to little, to complicated or to
simple.
I think improvments would be more warranted the this scenario.
12:47 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/16 L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com>om>:
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison
<mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
As for css
magic, I did my tumblr page myself
(http://bitdata.tumblr.com/), which is pretty simple and old css
(apart for the fonts).
On 15 December 2011 19:29, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Well I can do some css magic. It will look good and render on modern
browsers (forget about konqueror tho).
Not using databases is a big problem, since it practically constrains
you to use static pages. As I said we could use the wiki system for
everything. I'll try to make a draft after I finish pkgbuilds.
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
Indeed it looks great and works well, though I think it is very complicated
(it is hosted in their git repository so you can see)
I'd like to see some things.
A "planet" - basically it's a feed for all of our different blogs into one
page.
A "apps" section, I think Darrell spoke about this before.
In fact, Darrell had a lot of good stuff and ideas for simplifying the
navigation of the website, they're somewhere in the mail logs recently.
I think we are avoiding using any sort of databsases however and we want to
make sure tihs all will render well on any web browser.
Calvin Morrison
On 15 December 2011 18:01, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> 2011/12/15 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
> >
> >
> > On 15 December 2011 07:14, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> 2011/12/15 Nicolas Bercher <nbercher(a)yahoo.fr>fr>:
> >> > L0ner sh4dou a écrit :
> >> >
> >> >> You got me thinking about whole triselon thing. I did a two litte
> >> >> sketches for trinity logo proposal.
> >> >> First: http://db.tt/LwqZWTuP
> >> >> Second: http://db.tt/YpivoAGk
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Maybe the "T" is not that much important and the logo could
be
> >> > designed
> >> > without it.
> >> >
> >> > Nicolas
> >> >
> >> If we remove the t from the second one we will just get logo of
> >> Trisquel linux. For the first one it's integral part of logo,
> >> without
> >> it the space looks 'empty' to me.
> >>
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> >> trinity-devel-unsubscribe(a)lists.pearsoncomputing.net
> >> For additional commands, e-mail:
> >> trinity-devel-help(a)lists.pearsoncomputing.net
> >> Read list messsages on the Web archive:
> >> http://trinity-devel.pearsoncomputing.net/
> >> Please remember not to top-post:
> >> http://trinity.pearsoncomputing.net/mailing_lists/#top-posting
> >>
> >
> > I like the first one more than the second (reminds me of the
> > trisequal
> > logo
> > to much, could be taken as far as a blatant rip off :x)
> Same opinion here.
>
> >
> > Does no one like the current trinity logo? I sort of like it actually
> > :)
> > But
> > if I had to pick it would be the first one.
> >
> > I like the idea of the Gear. it reminds me of a hard working, well
> > tuned
> > machine designed for serious activities, rather than a less serious
> > one.
> Yes, but this gear is too strong reference to KDE, anyway we can have
> a gear-like tooths in the logo (like in second example).
> >
> > Could you create this as an SVG? I could give it a whack.
> >
> Only If I learn how to xD
> Anyway I'm more occupied by PKGBUILDs for arch ATM, so I will work on
> this after I finish those. This was to gather some ideas, since I want
> to create new webpage for trinity at some point (acutally second thing
> on my TO-DO list, after PKGBUILDs)
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> trinity-devel-unsubscribe(a)lists.pearsoncomputing.net
> For additional commands, e-mail:
> trinity-devel-help(a)lists.pearsoncomputing.net
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> http://trinity-devel.pearsoncomputing.net/
> Please remember not to top-post:
> http://trinity.pearsoncomputing.net/mailing_lists/#top-posting
>
Aside from archlinux packages I'm also the defacto website designer,
well
sort of.
I developed the current website ( a vast improvement from the previous
one )
and it's been quite careful.
We don't want anything to much, or to little, to complicated or to
simple.
I think improvments would be more warranted the this scenario.
I was thinking on relaying completely on the wiki system we use for
whole site. It can be done.
And I think we should add some sort of news system in which we will
write what actually happens inside the project, so it don't seem dead.
If we add ability to comment those news it will be like saying to
users "we care about what you think!". User-frendliness. This can be
done by using plugin for the wiki system.
Generally the archlinux site is a great inspiration for me. It's
simple, looks good and has everything you need.
1:20 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 15 December 2011 19:45, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison
<mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
Indeed it looks great and works well, though I think it is very complicated
We cannot have our homepage incorrectly load on our own web browser.
On 15 December 2011 19:29, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> 2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
> >
> >
> > On 15 December 2011 18:01, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> 2011/12/15 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On 15 December 2011 07:14, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> 2011/12/15 Nicolas Bercher <nbercher(a)yahoo.fr>fr>:
> >> >> > L0ner sh4dou a écrit :
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> You got me thinking about whole triselon thing. I did a
two
litte
> >> >> >> sketches for
trinity logo proposal.
> >> >> >> First: http://db.tt/LwqZWTuP
> >> >> >> Second: http://db.tt/YpivoAGk
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Maybe the "T" is not that much important and the
logo could be
> >> >> > designed
> >> >> > without it.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Nicolas
> >> >> >
> >> >> If we remove the t from the second one we will just get logo of
> >> >> Trisquel linux. For the first one it's integral part of logo,
> >> >> without
> >> >> it the space looks 'empty' to me.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> >> >> trinity-devel-unsubscribe(a)lists.pearsoncomputing.net
> >> >> For additional commands, e-mail:
> >> >> trinity-devel-help(a)lists.pearsoncomputing.net
> >> >> Read list messsages on the Web archive:
> >> >> http://trinity-devel.pearsoncomputing.net/
> >> >> Please remember not to top-post:
> >> >> http://trinity.pearsoncomputing.net/mailing_lists/#top-posting
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > I like the first one more than the second (reminds me of the
> >> > trisequal
> >> > logo
> >> > to much, could be taken as far as a blatant rip off :x)
> >> Same opinion here.
> >>
> >> >
> >> > Does no one like the current trinity logo? I sort of like it
actually
> >> > :)
> >> > But
> >> > if I had to pick it would be the first one.
> >> >
> >> > I like the idea of the Gear. it reminds me of a hard working, well
> >> > tuned
> >> > machine designed for serious activities, rather than a less serious
> >> > one.
> >> Yes, but this gear is too strong reference to KDE, anyway we can have
> >> a gear-like tooths in the logo (like in second example).
> >> >
> >> > Could you create this as an SVG? I could give it a whack.
> >> >
> >> Only If I learn how to xD
> >> Anyway I'm more occupied by PKGBUILDs for arch ATM, so I will work on
> >> this after I finish those. This was to gather some ideas, since I
want
> >> to create new webpage for trinity at
some point (acutally second
thing
> on my TO-DO list, after PKGBUILDs)
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> trinity-devel-unsubscribe(a)lists.pearsoncomputing.net
> For additional commands, e-mail:
> trinity-devel-help(a)lists.pearsoncomputing.net
> Read list messsages on the Web archive:
> http://trinity-devel.pearsoncomputing.net/
> Please remember not to top-post:
> http://trinity.pearsoncomputing.net/mailing_lists/#top-posting
>
Aside from archlinux packages I'm also the defacto website designer,
well
sort of.
I developed the current website ( a vast improvement from the previous
one )
and it's been quite careful.
We don't want anything to much, or to little, to complicated or to
simple.
I think improvments would be more warranted the this scenario.
I was thinking on relaying completely on the wiki system we use for
whole site. It can be done.
And I think we should add some sort of news system in which we will
write what actually happens inside the project, so it don't seem dead.
If we add ability to comment those news it will be like saying to
users "we care about what you think!". User-frendliness. This can be
done by using plugin for the wiki system.
Generally the archlinux site is a great inspiration for me. It's
simple, looks good and has everything you need.
(it is hosted in their git repository so you can
see)
I'd like to see some things.
A "planet" - basically it's a feed for all of our different blogs into
one
page.
A "apps" section, I think Darrell spoke about this before.
In fact, Darrell had a lot of good stuff and ideas for simplifying the
navigation of the website, they're somewhere in the mail logs recently.
I think we are avoiding using any sort of databsases however and we want
to
make sure tihs all will render well on any web
browser.
Calvin Morrison
Well I can do some css magic. It will look good and render on modern
browsers (forget about konqueror tho).
Not using databases is a big problem, since it
practically constrains
you to use static pages.
Basically - why is is this so bad?
As I said we could use the wiki system for
everything. I'll try to make a draft after I finish pkgbuilds.
Meh, I actually work on a wiki based education site, (
http://mathforum.org/mathimages/index.php/Main_Page) and it's a PITA to use
this for everything
Calvin
4:27 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 20:20:11 -0500
Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com> wrote:
We cannot have our homepage incorrectly load on our own web browser.
There is really no reason we should "forget about Konqueror"--it's
sufficiently
modern that it should support CSS1 and at least most of CSS2, and a fair
selection of Javascript constructs. It's possible to create a decent site
within those constraints, keeping in mind that it doesn't have to look
*identical* on both Konqueror and more recent browsers, just "good".
Graceful degredation in webpages is not rocket science.
However, one thing that we do need to keep in mind is that people who
haven't yet installed any other graphical environment may wish to download
Trinity packages--in other words, it would be wise to create something
that is usable in text-based browsers like Lynx (it doesn't have to be
elegant, but it should be possible to get from the root page to the package
downloads that way).
Depends on what we're trying to achieve. Dynamic pages ease certain
types of collaboration and user-added content, but static pages are not
intrinsically evil and put less of a load on the server.
On 15 December 2011 19:45, L0ner sh4dou
<sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> 2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
Indeed it looks great and works well, though I think
it is very
complicated
(it is hosted in their git repository so you can
see)
I'd like to see some things.
A "planet" - basically it's a feed for all of our different blogs into
one
page.
A "apps" section, I think Darrell spoke about this before.
In fact, Darrell had a lot of good stuff and ideas for simplifying the
navigation of the website, they're somewhere in the mail logs recently.
I think we are avoiding using any sort of databsases however and we want
to
make sure tihs all will render well on any web
browser.
Calvin Morrison
Well I can do some css magic. It will look good and render on modern
browsers (forget about konqueror tho).
Not using
databases is a big problem, since it practically constrains
you to use static pages.
Basically - why is is this so bad?
4:33 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 16 December 2011 11:27, E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 20:20:11 -0500
Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com> wrote:
There is really no reason we should "forget about Konqueror"--it's
sufficiently
modern that it should support CSS1 and at least most of CSS2, and a fair
selection of Javascript constructs. It's possible to create a decent site
within those constraints, keeping in mind that it doesn't have to look
*identical* on both Konqueror and more recent browsers, just "good".
Graceful degredation in webpages is not rocket science.
However, one thing that we do need to keep in mind is that people who
haven't yet installed any other graphical environment may wish to download
Trinity packages--in other words, it would be wise to create something
that is usable in text-based browsers like Lynx (it doesn't have to be
elegant, but it should be possible to get from the root page to the package
downloads that way).
Depends on what we're trying to achieve. Dynamic pages ease certain
types of collaboration and user-added content, but static pages are not
intrinsically evil and put less of a load on the server.
Both can be good, If anything I'd do a bit of both.
Simple php/html + a commenting system.
here is a good example of very basic and yet has dynamic elements:
http://incise.org/htpicker.html
On 15 December 2011 19:45, L0ner sh4dou
<sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> 2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
> > Indeed it looks great and works well,
though I think it is very
> complicated
> > (it is hosted in their git repository so you can see)
> >
> > I'd like to see some things.
> >
> > A "planet" - basically it's a feed for all of our different blogs
into
> one
> > page.
> >
> > A "apps" section, I think Darrell spoke about this before.
> >
> > In fact, Darrell had a lot of good stuff and ideas for simplifying
the
> > navigation of the website, they're
somewhere in the mail logs
recently.
> >
> > I think we are avoiding using any sort of databsases however and we
want
to
We cannot have our homepage incorrectly load on our own web browser. make sure tihs all will render well on any web
browser.
Calvin Morrison
Well I can do some css magic. It will look good and render on modern
browsers (forget about konqueror tho).
Not using
databases is a big problem, since it practically constrains
you to use static pages.
Basically - why is is this so bad?
4:55 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
On 16 December 2011 11:27, E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
It uses disqus for the comments, for which I have mixed feelings. I'd
rather not relay on external services for parts of the website.
On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 20:20:11 -0500
Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com> wrote:
There is really no reason we should "forget about Konqueror"--it's
sufficiently
modern that it should support CSS1 and at least most of CSS2, and a fair
selection of Javascript constructs. It's possible to create a decent site
within those constraints, keeping in mind that it doesn't have to look
*identical* on both Konqueror and more recent browsers, just "good".
Graceful degredation in webpages is not rocket science.
However, one thing that we do need to keep in mind is that people who
haven't yet installed any other graphical environment may wish to download
Trinity packages--in other words, it would be wise to create something
that is usable in text-based browsers like Lynx (it doesn't have to be
elegant, but it should be possible to get from the root page to the
package
downloads that way).
Depends on what we're trying to achieve. Dynamic pages ease certain
types of collaboration and user-added content, but static pages are not
intrinsically evil and put less of a load on the server.
Both can be good, If anything I'd do a bit of both.
Simple php/html + a commenting system.
here is a good example of very basic and yet has dynamic elements:
http://incise.org/htpicker.html On 15 December 2011 19:45, L0ner sh4dou
<sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> 2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
>
Indeed it looks great and works well, though I think it is very
complicated
> (it is hosted in their git repository so you can see)
>
> I'd like to see some things.
>
> A "planet" - basically it's a feed for all of our different blogs
> into
one
> page.
>
> A "apps" section, I think Darrell spoke about this before.
>
> In fact, Darrell had a lot of good stuff and ideas for simplifying
> the
> navigation of the website, they're somewhere in the mail logs
> recently.
>
> I think we are avoiding using any sort of databsases however and we
> want
to
> make sure tihs all will render well on any web browser.
>
> Calvin Morrison
Well I can do some css magic. It will look good and render on modern
browsers (forget about konqueror tho).
We cannot have our homepage incorrectly load on our own web browser. Not using
databases is a big problem, since it practically constrains
you to use static pages.
Basically - why is is this so bad?
5:41 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 17:55:47 +0100
L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison
<mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
I think Calvin was advocating the general concept, not the specific
implementation. I'm sure we can find an open-source, locally-hostable
comment system that requires only PHP, HTML4/XHTML1, and
CSS<=2 (and if we can't, I'm sure I'm not the only one here
capable of creating such a system if it turns out to be both useful
and necessary).
On 16 December 2011 11:27, E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
It uses disqus for the comments, for which I have mixed feelings. I'd
rather not relay on external services for parts of the website.
On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 20:20:11 -0500
Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Both can be good, If anything I'd do a bit of both.
Simple php/html + a commenting system.
here is a good example of very basic and yet has dynamic elements:
http://incise.org/htpicker.html On 15 December 2011 19:45, L0ner sh4dou
<sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> Not using databases is a big problem, since it practically constrains
> you to use static pages.
>
Basically - why is is this so bad?
Depends on what we're trying to achieve. Dynamic pages ease certain
types of collaboration and user-added content, but static pages are not
intrinsically evil and put less of a load on the server.
5:57 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/16 E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com>om>:
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 17:55:47 +0100
L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
That would be nice.
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison
<mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
I think Calvin was advocating the general concept, not the specific
implementation. I'm sure we can find an open-source, locally-hostable
comment system that requires only PHP, HTML4/XHTML1, and
CSS<=2 (and if we can't, I'm sure I'm not the only one here
capable of creating such a system if it turns out to be both useful
and necessary).
On 16 December 2011 11:27, E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
It uses disqus for the comments, for which I have mixed feelings. I'd
rather not relay on external services for parts of the website.
On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 20:20:11 -0500
Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> On 15 December 2011 19:45, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Not using databases is a big problem, since it practically constrains
> > you to use static pages.
> >
> Basically - why is is this so bad?
Depends on what we're trying to achieve. Dynamic pages ease certain
types of collaboration and user-added content, but static pages are not
intrinsically evil and put less of a load on the server.
Both can be good, If anything I'd do a bit of both.
Simple php/html + a commenting system.
here is a good example of very basic and yet has dynamic elements:
http://incise.org/htpicker.html
7:34 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 16 December 2011 12:57, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
2011/12/16 E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com>om>:
I think Calvin was advocating the general concept, not the specific
implementation. I'm sure we can find an open-source, locally-hostable
comment system that requires only PHP, HTML4/XHTML1, and
CSS<=2 (and if we can't, I'm sure I'm not the only one here
capable of creating such a system if it turns out to be both useful
and necessary).
That would be nice.
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http://ratherodd.com/commentator/ maybe?
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 17:55:47 +0100
L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> 2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
> >
> >
> > On 16 December 2011 11:27, E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 20:20:11 -0500
> >> Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> > On 15 December 2011 19:45, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > Not using databases is a big problem, since it practically
constrains
> >> > > you to use static pages.
> >> > >
> >> > Basically - why is is this so bad?
> >>
> >> Depends on what we're trying to achieve. Dynamic pages ease certain
> >> types of collaboration and user-added content, but static pages are
not
> intrinsically evil and put less of a load on the
server.
Both can be good, If anything I'd do a bit of both.
Simple php/html + a commenting system.
here is a good example of very basic and yet has dynamic elements:
http://incise.org/htpicker.html
It uses disqus for the comments, for which I have mixed feelings. I'd
rather not relay on external services for parts of the website.
8:12 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
On 16 December 2011 12:57, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Looks nice, MYSQL db required tho.
2011/12/16 E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com>om>:
http://ratherodd.com/commentator/ maybe? On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 17:55:47 +0100
L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
That would be nice.
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2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison
<mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
>
>
> On 16 December 2011 11:27, E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 20:20:11 -0500
>> Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > On 15 December 2011 19:45, L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > > Not using databases is a big problem, since it practically
>> > > constrains
>> > > you to use static pages.
>> > >
>> > Basically - why is is this so bad?
>>
>> Depends on what we're trying to achieve. Dynamic pages ease certain
>> types of collaboration and user-added content, but static pages are
>> not
>> intrinsically evil and put less of a load on the server.
>
>
> Both can be good, If anything I'd do a bit of both.
>
> Simple php/html + a commenting system.
>
> here is a good example of very basic and yet has dynamic elements:
> http://incise.org/htpicker.html
It uses disqus for the comments, for which I have mixed feelings. I'd
rather not relay on external services for parts of the website.
I think Calvin was advocating the general concept, not the specific
implementation. I'm sure we can find an open-source, locally-hostable
comment system that requires only PHP, HTML4/XHTML1, and
CSS<=2 (and if we can't, I'm sure I'm not the only one here
capable of creating such a system if it turns out to be both useful
and necessary).
7:37 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
There is really no reason we should "forget
about
Konqueror"--it's sufficiently
modern that it should support CSS1 and at least most of
CSS2, and a fair
selection of Javascript constructs. It's possible to
create a decent site
within those constraints, keeping in mind that it doesn't
have to look
*identical* on both Konqueror and more recent browsers,
just "good".
Graceful degredation in webpages is not rocket science.
However, one thing that we do need to keep in mind is that
people who
haven't yet installed any other graphical environment may
wish to download
Trinity packages--in other words, it would be wise to
create something
that is usable in text-based browsers like Lynx (it doesn't
have to be
elegant, but it should be possible to get from the root
page to the package
downloads that way).
Depends on what we're trying to achieve. Dynamic
pages ease certain
types of collaboration and user-added content, but static
pages are not
intrinsically evil and put less of a load on the server.
Please. Please! No JavaScript with the Trinity web site. Supporters of JavaScript should
take long walks on short piers, preferably while inebriated.
I hate JavaScript, the bane of the internet. Bandwidth hog and security nightmare.
Bad enough already that I have to white list that crap to access etherpad and the wiki.
(Hint, hint.)
Please create static web pages.
Darrell
> Not using databases is a big problem, since
it
practically constrains
you to
use static pages.
Basically - why is is this so bad? 
7:53 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 11:37:39 -0800 (PST)
Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
I hate JavaScript, the bane of the internet. Bandwidth
hog and
security nightmare.
JavaScript is a client-side language, it generates no bandwith
in
itself. Some years ago I did local web pages with Javascript, and it is
actually quite useful to do Flash-less games and animations for example.
Bad enough already that I have to white list that crap to access
etherpad and the wiki. (Hint, hint.)
The thing I hate with Etherpad is that it
requires cookies even to view
public pads without being logged in.
Please create static web pages.
Javascript and static web pages are compatible
(using DOM and/or
document.write is not mandatory).
8:24 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 16 December 2011 14:53, /dev/ammo42 <mickeytintincolle(a)yahoo.fr> wrote:
You could also use static html forms for a comment system, though frankly
I'd rather use javascript to achieve the same end.
L0ner:
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 11:37:39 -0800 (PST)
Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
yes, but that is life. you must adapt to the world
around you.
JavaScript is a client-side language, it generates no bandwith in
I hate JavaScript, the bane of the internet.
Bandwidth hog and
security nightmare.
itself. Some years ago I did local web pages with
Javascript, and it is
actually quite useful to do Flash-less games and animations for example.
Exactly! guys this isn't 1994 and people expect to use dynamic websites,
Javascript isn't terrible and evil when used in good proportion
Bad enough already that I have to white list that crap
to access
Offtopic but that is another issue
etherpad and the wiki. (Hint, hint.)
The
thing I hate with Etherpad is that it requires cookies even to view
public pads without being logged in.
Please create static web pages.
Javascript and static web pages are compatible (using DOM and/or
document.write is not mandatory).
Looks nice, MYSQL db required tho.
I am sure Tim is already mysql, so no overhead. and mysql isn't all bad
either ;)
9:40 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 15:24:28 -0500
Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com> wrote:
On 16 December 2011 14:53, /dev/ammo42
<mickeytintincolle(a)yahoo.fr> wrote:
If I believed that, I would be using Windows. :P
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 11:37:39 -0800 (PST)
Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
yes, but that is life. you must adapt to the world
around you. I hate JavaScript, the bane of the internet.
Bandwidth hog and
security nightmare.
JavaScript is a client-side language, it generates no
bandwith in
Used properly, Javascript can make a nice enhancement to a webpage, but
*requiring* it in order to use a page is usually just bad design--same as Flash.
(I make an exception for games and some types of complex cloud-hosted
applications, however.) It's good for making user feedback more prompt,
and for certain types of visual effects that appeal to the sort of people who
leave it turned on, but in general, if it's used to do anything *important* (like
site navigation, or form validation or submission), that action should
also be possible without it. The NOSCRIPT element is good for more than
displaying stupid "we don't want to let you use our site" messages, and so
is
server-side code.
itself. Some years ago I did local web pages with
Javascript, and it is
actually quite useful to do Flash-less games and animations for example.
Exactly! guys this isn't 1994 and people expect to use dynamic websites,
Javascript isn't terrible and evil when used in good proportion
10:10 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
I hate
JavaScript, the bane of the internet. Bandwidth
hog and
security nightmare.
yes, but that is life.
you must
adapt to the world around you. Exactly! guys this isn't 1994 and people expect to
use
dynamic websites, Javascript isn't terrible and evil
when used in good proportion
You have lake front property in Nevada for sale too? :)
JS sucks. Cookies suck.
Javascript and static web pages are compatible (using
DOM and/or
document.write is not mandatory).
You could also use static
html forms for a comment system, though frankly I'd
rather use javascript to achieve the same end.
Enable JS all you want but if functionality is not available without enabling JS then
screw people who are not on broadband. Many people today are not on broadband because of
cost or lack of availability. If the TDE team wants to target people using older hardware
as good candidates for TDE, then consider the overall environment of these people.
JS might be client-side, but the scripts still must be downloaded to function. People on
older hardware do not have the CPU or graphics muscle in their machines to tolerate JS. I
have older machines here that I use in my testing. Those machines can't deal with all
the Web 2.0 bullsh-t.
That has always been a problem with computers. Devs use bleeding edge hardware and never
test their apps or web sites with older hardware. Most of them have high broadband
connections and never test with anything else.
Speaking of which, web devs need to test their pages on smaller monitors. Most web pages
these days are designed on monitors bigger than most TVS and when the web page is viewed
on a smaller monitor the text is too small to read by anybody with vision issues.
All I'm saying here is don't be an ass wipe with redesigning the web site. :)
Darrell
10:42 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 16 December 2011 17:10, Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
I don't have to do jack sh-t. ;) :) I enable JS only when I want to, which
is very seldom.
No.
Javascript is not a issue for bandwidth, it won't present an issue since it
is interpreted locally. The only functionality I am suggesting not exist is
a commenting system - which is non-essential.
JS might be client-side, but the scripts still must be downloaded to
I hate JavaScript, the bane of the internet. Bandwidth
hog and
security nightmare.
yes, but that is life.
you must
adapt to the world around you. Exactly! guys this isn't 1994 and people
expect to use
dynamic websites, Javascript isn't terrible and evil
when used in good proportion
You have lake front property in Nevada for sale too? :)
JS sucks. Cookies suck.
No. Wrong wrong wrong. Cookies are great when used to store information I
wanted stored, like preferences or to stay logged into a website, tracking
cookies are obviously bad however.
Javascript and
static web pages are compatible (using
DOM and/or
document.write is not mandatory).
You could also use static
html forms for a comment system, though frankly I'd
rather use javascript to achieve the same end.
Enable JS all you want but if functionality is not available without
enabling JS then screw people who are not on broadband. Many people today
are not on broadband because of cost or lack of availability. If the TDE
team wants to target people using older hardware as good candidates for
TDE, then consider the overall environment of these people.
function. People on older hardware do not have the CPU
or graphics muscle
in their machines to tolerate JS. I have older machines here that I use in
my testing. Those machines can't deal with all the Web 2.0 bullsh-t.
Scripts are just small text files, overhead is as minimal as the already
existing CSS files. (or do you have that disabled too?) Javascript is 15+
years old. Stop being absurd! Are you running machines that are pre-pentium
1? Of course we won't be rendering WebGL 3D frames, we'll be using very
simplistic javascript to achieve a minimal end. In fact most websites these
days depend on it.
That has always been a problem with computers. Devs
use bleeding edge
hardware and never test their apps or web sites with older hardware. Most
of them have high broadband connections and never test with anything else.
I concur with this sentiment, spending my whole life on sub par machines. I
do understand this, but I think our website will be fine
Speaking of which, web devs need to test their pages on smaller monitors.
Most web pages these days are designed on monitors bigger than most TVS and
when the web page is viewed on a smaller monitor the text is too small to
read by anybody with vision issues.
I concur with this as well. I think we need to work on our top display bar,
other than that the website works well. It renders well in a 640x640 window
All I'm saying here is don't be an ass wipe
with redesigning the web site.
:)
Contributions appreciated, as the old arch saying goes "patches are
welcome!" or "put up or shut up" applies as well.
Calvin Morrison
10:48 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
<snip>
Just a reminder to keep it civil here folks. Personally I try to provide
both a JS and non-JS version of any given feature--while people may no
longer have K6 CPUs not everyone has an Android/iPhone either. Providing
a non-JS version allows people with midgrade phones to still use all the
features of the website.
Regarding stability, in theory javascript should be OK. In practice the
JS engine built into a given browser can leak memory quite badly--for me
this manifests as having to regularly restart Firefox, which gets to be
quite a nuiscance over time. TDE might end up (randomly) being the site
that pushes the user's system over a memory limit, and nothing says
"professional" like a site appearing to crash the users' browser.
Just something to keep in mind. ;-)
Tim
All I'm saying here is don't be an ass
wipe with redesigning the web
site.
:)
Contributions appreciated, as the old arch saying goes "patches are
welcome!" or "put up or shut up" applies as well.
Calvin Morrison
10:54 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 16 December 2011 17:48, Timothy Pearson <kb9vqf(a)pearsoncomputing.net>wrote;wrote:
<snip>
Just a reminder to keep it civil here folks. Personally I try to provide
both a JS and non-JS version of any given feature--while people may no
longer have K6 CPUs not everyone has an Android/iPhone either. Providing
a non-JS version allows people with midgrade phones to still use all the
features of the website.
Again, I am not suggesting implementing a giant javascript hell. I am
suggesting a small and simple piece of JavaScript to enable community
interaction via a comment system.
Regarding stability, in theory javascript should be OK. In practice the
All I'm saying here is don't be an ass
wipe with redesigning the web
site.
:)
Contributions appreciated, as the old arch saying goes "patches are
welcome!" or "put up or shut up" applies as well.
Calvin Morrison
JS engine built into a given browser can leak memory
quite badly--for me
this manifests as having to regularly restart Firefox, which gets to be
quite a nuiscance over time. TDE might end up (randomly) being the site
that pushes the user's system over a memory limit, and nothing says
"professional" like a site appearing to crash the users' browser.
Firefox has long lost any control over it's ability to manage memory. As of
the latest builds, it can no longer be compiled on a 32bit system because
the linker uses 3gb+ of memory.
:)
11:42 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
Personally I try to provide
both a JS and non-JS version of any given feature--while
people may no
longer have K6 CPUs not everyone has an Android/iPhone
either. Providing
a non-JS version allows people with midgrade phones to
still use all the
features of the website.
That is my basic point. Don't make JavaScript a functional requirement. JavaScript
should be an option. Those who do not use JavaScript should not be prohibited from
enjoying the web site or contributing comments.
Regarding stability, in theory javascript should be
OK. In practice the
JS engine built into a given browser can leak memory quite
badly--for me
this manifests as having to regularly restart Firefox,
which gets to be
quite a nuiscance over time. TDE might end up
(randomly) being the site
that pushes the user's system over a memory limit, and
nothing says
"professional" like a site appearing to crash the users'
browser.
Being in the engineering and technical fields much of my adult life, I have learned that
theory and practice often don't coincide nicely. :)
I long have suspected that my low usage of JavaScript helps me avoid the common complaints
about Firefox crashing and memory leaks. Who knows.
I agree that any software that crashes in itself makes a resounding statement about
quality assurance and lacks a professional image. :)
Darrell
17 Dec
17 Dec
12:08 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 15:42:14 -0800 (PST)
Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
I long have suspected that my low usage of JavaScript
helps me avoid
the common complaints about Firefox crashing and memory leaks. Who
knows.
With me Firefox (either 3.6 or latest) hasn't crashed for months, even
though JavaScript is allowed everywhere. However, I use Privoxy for
ad-blocking and I don't use Flash.
For memory leaks I actually don't give a **** considering I have 6G or
RAM.
5:19 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
<rage>
Ok, people, stop it!
I haven't participated for the past month because I've been tired,
sick, and I've already fainted twice this month because of that. Not
fun.
(background of raging)
But this is really getting out of hand. What the hell does Javascript,
Firefox, or cookies have to do with the Trinity logo? NOTHING.
So move it to another thread and stop filling this one. I also suggest
to stop friendly insulting each other (I know both of you don't mean
it), but from a public view it != nice.
</rage>
Sorry about that rage, but I mean it.
--
later daze.
6:10 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
With me Firefox (either 3.6 or latest) hasn't
crashed for
months, even
though JavaScript is allowed everywhere. However, I use
Privoxy for
ad-blocking and I don't use Flash.
I use a simple but effective ad blocking scheme and allow flash only on two sites that I
visit only occasionally. I disable iframes and Java. Perhaps that helps too. :)
I'm still using 3.6.x. I don't remember the last time Firefox crashed.
Darrell
16 Dec
16 Dec
11:30 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
Wrong wrong wrong. Cookies are great when used to
store
information I wanted stored, like preferences or to stay
logged into a website, tracking cookies are obviously bad
however.
Let me rephrase. When a web site refuses to load because cookies are not enabled, then the
web site designer is playing the role of a fool. I came across such a site today (Sears),
researching a product. Because I use a white list approach for cookies, I do not have
cookies enabled globally. All I received from the web site was a message that I did not
have cookies enabled. No product information. I closed the page and moved on. I'm not
dealing with idiots like that.
Cookies are fine when the END-USER finds them useful. When cookies are required to merely
use a web site (like etherpad) then there is something inherently wrong with the design.
The same goes for JavaScript. For example, visit the Asus downloads site. No meaningful
function at all unless JavaScript is enabled. The Amazon web site is another example in
that viewing alternate images is not possible without JavaScript. That's not good
design.
Javascript is not a issue for bandwidth, it won't
present an issue since it is interpreted locally. The only
functionality I am suggesting not exist is a commenting
system - which is non-essential.
JavaScript IS a bandwidth issue. Try surfing the web all day on dial-up.
Although today I have a broadband connection, the connection is not high-end or robust. I
still very much experience the overhead of all the web 2.0 nonsense.
And what is wrong with a simple forms-based comment section, much like we saw in the pre
Web 2.0 days? Nothing wrong. People get mad when they configure a JavaScript white list in
their browser and visit a site where they have to temporarily enable JavaScript.
Scripts are just small text files, overhead is as
minimal
as the already existing CSS files. (or do you have that
disabled too?) Javascript is 15+ years old. Stop being
absurd! Are you running machines that are pre-pentium 1? Of
course we won't be rendering WebGL 3D frames, we'll
be using very simplistic javascript to achieve a minimal
end. In fact most websites these days depend on it.
I'm being realistic. We have two different perspectives. I was using computers back
before there were BBSs. Back when there was no world wide web. All we had were modems. I
remember when sites had to be designed to be efficient, which seldom happens anymore.
Until a few years ago I had to survive on dial-up. I have not forgotten those days and I
will not forget people still using dial-up or low broadband connections.
I see TDE as being a good desktop for people using older hardware. People using older
hardware are unlikely to have fast connectivitiy.
That you allege many web sites today depend upon JavaScript is about the same as saying
everybody else is jumping off the cliff so let's do that too. I never have been much
of a "jump on the bandwagon" person. :)
I concur with this as well. I think we
need to work on our top display bar, other than that the
website works well. It renders well in a 640x640 window
My recommendations included a simpler nav bar.
Contributions appreciated, as the old arch saying
goes
"patches are welcome!" or "put up or shut
up" applies as well.
I'm feeling feisty today. So my contributions with this topic are rocks thrown hard. I
have no patience for this web 2.0 crap. :)
Darrell
11:47 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 16 December 2011 18:30, Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
Amazon.com caters to the 99.999999999999% of users who have javascript
enabled. Frankly as a web developer, I'd be insane to have to assume
everyone had it turned off.
Although today I have a broadband connection, the connection is not
You sound like an old fogie who is concerned that rock and roll is from the
devil. Again our website is very minimalist and will continue to do so,
Javascript or not.
I see TDE as being a good desktop for people using older hardware. People
Wrong wrong
wrong. Cookies are great when used to store
information I wanted stored, like preferences or to stay
logged into a website, tracking cookies are obviously bad
however.
Let me rephrase. When a web site refuses to load because cookies are not
enabled, then the web site designer is playing the role of a fool. I came
across such a site today (Sears), researching a product. Because I use a
white list approach for cookies, I do not have cookies enabled globally.
All I received from the web site was a message that I did not have cookies
enabled. No product information. I closed the page and moved on. I'm not
dealing with idiots like that.
Cookies are fine when the END-USER finds them useful. When cookies are
required to merely use a web site (like etherpad) then there is something
inherently wrong with the design.
The same goes for JavaScript. For example, visit the Asus downloads site.
No meaningful function at all unless JavaScript is enabled. The Amazon web
site is another example in that viewing alternate images is not possible
without JavaScript. That's not good design.
Javascript is
not a issue for bandwidth, it won't
present an issue since it is interpreted locally. The only
functionality I am suggesting not exist is a commenting
system - which is non-essential.
JavaScript IS a bandwidth issue. Try surfing the web all day on dial-up.
high-end or robust. I still very much experience the
overhead of all the
web 2.0 nonsense.
And what is wrong with a simple forms-based comment section, much like we
saw in the pre Web 2.0 days? Nothing wrong. People get mad when they
configure a JavaScript white list in their browser and visit a site where
they have to temporarily enable JavaScript.
This will be considered also as an option.
Scripts are
just small text files, overhead is as minimal
as the already existing CSS files. (or do you have that
disabled too?) Javascript is 15+ years old. Stop being
absurd! Are you running machines that are pre-pentium 1? Of
course we won't be rendering WebGL 3D frames, we'll
be using very simplistic javascript to achieve a minimal
end. In fact most websites these days depend on it.
I'm being realistic. We have two different perspectives. I was using
computers back before there were BBSs. Back when there was no world wide
web. All we had were modems. I remember when sites had to be designed to be
efficient, which seldom happens anymore. Until a few years ago I had to
survive on dial-up. I have not forgotten those days and I will not forget
people still using dial-up or low broadband connections.
using older hardware are unlikely to have fast
connectivitiy.
I don't think there is a direct connection between the two. Then again
people using linux are more likely to know about computers and want a
faster connection.
That you allege many web sites today depend upon JavaScript is about the
same as saying everybody else is jumping off the cliff
so let's do that
too. I never have been much of a "jump on the bandwagon" person. :)
Sink or swim, I'm diving in. Again, comments are a thing of Web 2.0 and
interactive webpages are as well. If we want these features then we need to
implement them in a modern way.
I concur with this as well. I think we
Yep duely noted.
Calvin Morrison
need to work on our top display bar, other than
that the
website works well. It renders well in a 640x640 window
My recommendations included a simpler nav bar.
17 Dec
17 Dec
12:11 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
You sound like an old fogie who is concerned that rock
and
roll is from the devil.
Wrong guess, minus five! I was listening to rock and roll and driving my parents bonkers
long before you were born. :)
I don't think there is a direct connection between
the
two. Then again people using linux are more likely to know
about computers and want a faster connection.
Wanting a faster connection is not the same as having one. When broadband is unavailable,
which is true in many rural and less developed regions, then wanting won't change
that. :)
Linux based systems often are touted as a way to extend the life of older hardware.
Frankly, with what I have seen in free/libre software the past few years, that statement
long ago vanished from any truth like the dew on a hot sunny morning. As I said, devs
seldom design or test their software on older hardware. Short of minimalistic window
managers, the only remaining full desktop environments for older hardware are LXDE, Xfce,
and TDE. And Xfce is getting bloated too.
Darrell
12:34 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/17 Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com>om>:
This discussion has gone.. where? I started it to gather opinions for
new logo for trinity and trinity website since actuall resembles too
much that of kde. What I got is bunch of people disussing which
technologies we should use and which not on our new website (that
isn't even in early project state, just a simple idea in my mind).
And now we are shifting to TDE target...
Honestly, IMO this is wrong.
You sound like
an old fogie who is concerned that rock and
roll is from the devil.
Wrong guess, minus five! I was listening to rock and roll and driving my parents bonkers
long before you were born. :)
I don't think there is a direct connection
between the
two. Then again people using linux are more likely to know
about computers and want a faster connection.
Wanting a faster connection is not the same as having one. When broadband is unavailable,
which is true in many rural and less developed regions, then wanting won't change
that. :)
Linux based systems often are touted as a way to extend the life of older hardware.
Frankly, with what I have seen in free/libre software the past few years, that statement
long ago vanished from any truth like the dew on a hot sunny morning. As I said, devs
seldom design or test their software on older hardware. Short of minimalistic window
managers, the only remaining full desktop environments for older hardware are LXDE, Xfce,
and TDE. And Xfce is getting bloated too.
Darrell
12:35 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 16 December 2011 19:11, Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
I do not even consider LXDE an environment. They use open box, provide a
panel and a session manager, a few apps as well.
An environment is a cohesive and integrated place to work. XFCE and TDE are
good environments.
Then again, developers in FOSS do it primarily for fun, if they use high
end boxes, they have no incentive to make it work on a older machine
Just a thought
Calvin Morrison
You sound like
an old fogie who is concerned that rock and
roll is from the devil.
Wrong guess, minus five! I was listening to rock and roll and driving my
parents bonkers long before you were born. :)
I don't think there is a direct connection
between the
two. Then again people using linux are more likely to know
about computers and want a faster connection.
Wanting a faster connection is not the same as having one. When broadband
is unavailable, which is true in many rural and less developed regions,
then wanting won't change that. :)
Linux based systems often are touted as a way to extend the life of older
hardware. Frankly, with what I have seen in free/libre software the past
few years, that statement long ago vanished from any truth like the dew on
a hot sunny morning. As I said, devs seldom design or test their software
on older hardware. Short of minimalistic window managers, the only
remaining full desktop environments for older hardware are LXDE, Xfce, and
TDE. And Xfce is getting bloated too.
Darrell
16 Dec
16 Dec
10:42 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 14:10:31 -0800 (PST)
Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
Enable JS all you want but if functionality is not
available without
enabling JS then screw people who are not on broadband. Many people
today are not on broadband because of cost or lack of availability.
If the TDE team wants to target people using older hardware as good
candidates for TDE, then consider the overall environment of these
people.
JS might be client-side, but the scripts still must be downloaded to
function. People on older hardware do not have the CPU or graphics
muscle in their machines to tolerate JS. I have older machines here
that I use in my testing. Those machines can't deal with all the Web
2.0 bullsh-t.
JS is not a big download, it is just C-like interpreted code. Also,
I don't agree at all with the "Web 2.0 bullsh*t" denomination you put
on Javascript: actually I learnt it with a computer without Internet
access and W98/IE4, well before the real Web 2.0 bullsh*t. The bullsh*t
is rather big commercial sites with large ads, fancy graphic effects and
large images all the way, that always gonna give c*** should they be
made in JS, Flash or any another technology.
That has always been a problem with computers. Devs use bleeding edge
hardware and never test their apps or web sites with older hardware.
Most of them have high broadband connections and never test with
anything else.
I think that the popularity of "smart"-phones will
entice/is enticing
Web developers to make semi-reasonable sites (but which are still
likely to knee down a K6-II).
Speaking of which, web devs need to test their pages on smaller
monitors. Most web pages these days are designed on monitors bigger
than most TVS and when the web page is viewed on a smaller monitor
the text is too small to read by anybody with vision issues.
Like for the above
point, "smart"-phones have lower resolutions and
smaller monitors.
All I'm saying here is don't be an ass wipe with redesigning the web
site. :)
Darrell
10:44 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 16 December 2011 17:42, /dev/ammo42 <mickeytintincolle(a)yahoo.fr> wrote:
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 14:10:31 -0800 (PST)
Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
What about developing a mobile site? :-)
Enable JS all you want but if functionality is
not available without
enabling JS then screw people who are not on broadband. Many people
today are not on broadband because of cost or lack of availability.
If the TDE team wants to target people using older hardware as good
candidates for TDE, then consider the overall environment of these
people.
JS might be client-side, but the scripts still must be downloaded to
function. People on older hardware do not have the CPU or graphics
muscle in their machines to tolerate JS. I have older machines here
that I use in my testing. Those machines can't deal with all the Web
2.0 bullsh-t.
JS is not a big download, it is just C-like interpreted code. Also,
I don't agree at all with the "Web 2.0 bullsh*t" denomination you put
on Javascript: actually I learnt it with a computer without Internet
access and W98/IE4, well before the real Web 2.0 bullsh*t. The bullsh*t
is rather big commercial sites with large ads, fancy graphic effects and
large images all the way, that always gonna give c*** should they be
made in JS, Flash or any another technology.
That has always been a problem with computers. Devs use bleeding edge
hardware and never test their apps or web sites with older hardware.
Most of them have high broadband connections and never test with
anything else.
I think that the popularity of "smart"-phones will
entice/is enticing
Web developers to make semi-reasonable sites (but which are still
likely to knee down a K6-II).
Speaking of which, web devs need to test their pages on smaller
monitors. Most web pages these days are designed on monitors bigger
than most TVS and when the web page is viewed on a smaller monitor
the text is too small to read by anybody with vision issues.
Like for the above
point, "smart"-phones have lower resolutions and
smaller monitors.
All I'm saying here is don't be an ass wipe with redesigning the web
site. :)
10:47 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
On 16 December 2011 17:42, /dev/ammo42 <mickeytintincolle(a)yahoo.fr> wrote:
Never did this, maybe it would be nice to have one.
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 14:10:31 -0800 (PST)
Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
What about developing a mobile site? :-) Enable JS all you want but if functionality is
not available without
enabling JS then screw people who are not on broadband. Many people
today are not on broadband because of cost or lack of availability.
If the TDE team wants to target people using older hardware as good
candidates for TDE, then consider the overall environment of these
people.
JS might be client-side, but the scripts still must be downloaded to
function. People on older hardware do not have the CPU or graphics
muscle in their machines to tolerate JS. I have older machines here
that I use in my testing. Those machines can't deal with all the Web
2.0 bullsh-t.
JS is not a big download, it is just C-like interpreted code. Also,
I don't agree at all with the "Web 2.0 bullsh*t" denomination you put
on Javascript: actually I learnt it with a computer without Internet
access and W98/IE4, well before the real Web 2.0 bullsh*t. The bullsh*t
is rather big commercial sites with large ads, fancy graphic effects and
large images all the way, that always gonna give c*** should they be
made in JS, Flash or any another technology.
That has always been a problem with computers. Devs use bleeding edge
hardware and never test their apps or web sites with older hardware.
Most of them have high broadband connections and never test with
anything else.
I think that the popularity of "smart"-phones will
entice/is enticing
Web developers to make semi-reasonable sites (but which are still
likely to knee down a K6-II).
Speaking of which, web devs need to test their pages on smaller
monitors. Most web pages these days are designed on monitors bigger
than most TVS and when the web page is viewed on a smaller monitor
the text is too small to read by anybody with vision issues.
Like for the above
point, "smart"-phones have lower resolutions and
smaller monitors.
>
> All I'm saying here is don't be an ass wipe with redesigning the web
> site. :)
>
>
10:54 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 17:44:42 -0500
Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com> wrote:
What about developing a mobile site? :-)
<obvioustrollisobvious>I'd rather see a "kde.org Active" mobile
website
from the one-major-version-higher people ;)
And obviously it would use server-side NEPOMUK/Akonadi everywhere so we
can could expect actually it to actually be working for the next minor
release.</obvioustrollisobvious>
1:19 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
A "apps" section, I think Darrell spoke
about
this before.
In fact, Darrell had a lot of good stuff and ideas for
simplifying the navigation of the website, they're
somewhere in the mail logs recently.
Updating the web site is on hold until the GIT migration and file renaming projects are
complete. Tim has the suggestions. I believe he will update the web site after the GIT and
file renaming projects are complete.
I'm still creating a basic apps description list.
My two cents about the logo is I like the current logo with the gears and T. The logo
shows our roots to KDE3 but maintains a separate identity.
I am not concerned with goofballs misinterpreting what Trinity means. Just about any name
can be perceived by fanatics as meaning something "sinister."
One rabbi and one blogger have their heads stuffed where the sun doesn't shine. That
is not a loss of market share.
Tim has expended too much energy with the renaming project to begin anew. Not to mention
the many places the word Trinity is used and also would need to be replaced. For example,
all Handbook help files, About descriptions, etc.
I'm aware of the various meanings but the name Trinity does not bother me.
The proposed FAQ in etherpad explains the meaning, in the History section. The FAQ will
become part of the updated web site.
Darrell
1:22 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 15 December 2011 20:19, Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
I vote to have the trinity website available in a git repository, making
more fluid website developement. Tim has cited concerns about website
security, but we could just not upload possible areas for harm. Anyone have
thoughts on this idea?
A
"apps" section, I think Darrell spoke about
this before.
In fact, Darrell had a lot of good stuff and ideas for
simplifying the navigation of the website, they're
somewhere in the mail logs recently.
Updating the web site is on hold until the GIT migration and file renaming
projects are complete. Tim has the suggestions. I believe he will update
the web site after the GIT and file renaming projects are complete.
I'm still creating a basic apps description list.
My two cents about the logo is I like the current logo with the gears and
T. The logo shows our roots to KDE3 but maintains a separate identity.
I am not concerned with goofballs misinterpreting what Trinity means. Just
about any name can be perceived by fanatics as meaning something "sinister."
One rabbi and one blogger have their heads stuffed where the sun doesn't
shine. That is not a loss of market share.
Tim has expended too much energy with the renaming project to begin anew.
Not to mention the many places the word Trinity is used and also would need
to be replaced. For example, all Handbook help files, About descriptions,
etc.
I'm aware of the various meanings but the name Trinity does not bother me.
The proposed FAQ in etherpad explains the meaning, in the History section.
The FAQ will become part of the updated web site.
Darrell
1:45 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
On 15 December 2011 20:19, Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
I vote to have the trinity website available in a git repository, making
more fluid website developement. Tim has cited concerns about website
security, but we could just not upload possible areas for harm. Anyone have
thoughts on this idea?
I don't know anything about it, i never did it before. But seems like
a nice idea.
A "apps" section, I think Darrell spoke
about
this before.
In fact, Darrell had a lot of good stuff and ideas for
simplifying the navigation of the website, they're
somewhere in the mail logs recently.
Updating the web site is on hold until the GIT migration and file renaming
projects are complete. Tim has the suggestions. I believe he will update the
web site after the GIT and file renaming projects are complete.
I'm still creating a basic apps description list.
My two cents about the logo is I like the current logo with the gears and
T. The logo shows our roots to KDE3 but maintains a separate identity.
I am not concerned with goofballs misinterpreting what Trinity means. Just
about any name can be perceived by fanatics as meaning something "sinister."
One rabbi and one blogger have their heads stuffed where the sun doesn't
shine. That is not a loss of market share.
Tim has expended too much energy with the renaming project to begin anew.
Not to mention the many places the word Trinity is used and also would need
to be replaced. For example, all Handbook help files, About descriptions,
etc.
I'm aware of the various meanings but the name Trinity does not bother me.
The proposed FAQ in etherpad explains the meaning, in the History section.
The FAQ will become part of the updated web site.
Darrell 
7:29 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Friday 16 December 2011 02:22:01 Calvin Morrison wrote:
I vote to have the trinity website available in a git
repository, making
more fluid website developement. Tim has cited concerns about website
security, but we could just not upload possible areas for harm. Anyone have
thoughts on this idea?
keeping a website's sources in a VCS is always a good idea.
so, why not put the trinity site in git, too, but simply restrict (also read!)
access to those actually working on it ?
werner
12:16 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
I might be a very ignorant in this topic. But I don't see a
justification for the rebranding. The product is *still* KDE on 99.9%
with a few bugs fixed. If there will be some large but hidden changes
like moving from HAL to UDEV, moving from DCOP to DBUS, XDG
compliance, etc. It will be *still* KDE user experience. The UI is
developed by KDE and the UI is that is valued most here. So this fuss
about replacement of K with T bothers me much! And this seem to take
too much energy instead of fixing real bugs.
And by the way pronounciation of TDE sounds awkward... So I'm all
against it. Though I am just a user.
12:44 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 16 December 2011 07:16, Aleksey Midenkov <midenok(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I might be a very ignorant in this topic. But I
don't see a
justification for the rebranding. The product is *still* KDE on 99.9%
with a few bugs fixed. If there will be some large but hidden changes
like moving from HAL to UDEV, moving from DCOP to DBUS, XDG
compliance, etc. It will be *still* KDE user experience.
Similar code, but it is nNo longer a KDE product
The UI is
developed by KDE and the UI is that is valued most here. So this fuss
about replacement of K with T bothers me much! And this seem to take
too much energy instead of fixing real bugs.
The UI was developed by KDE, no longer is. therefore we cannot continue
using their name or conventions. We need to respect the KDE e.v and their
wishes as well.
And by the way pronounciation of TDE sounds awkward... So I'm all
against it. Though I am just a user.
and Guh-Nome and Kay-Dee_Eeh sound better? I think the best solution is to
just call it Trinity Desktop :)
Calvin Morrison
12:53 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/16 Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com>om>:
On 16 December 2011 07:16, Aleksey Midenkov <midenok(a)gmail.com> wrote:
+10
I might be a very ignorant in this topic. But I don't see a
justification for the rebranding. The product is *still* KDE on 99.9%
with a few bugs fixed. If there will be some large but hidden changes
like moving from HAL to UDEV, moving from DCOP to DBUS, XDG
compliance, etc. It will be *still* KDE user experience.
Similar code, but it is nNo longer a KDE product
The UI is
developed by KDE and the UI is that is valued most here. So this fuss
about replacement of K with T bothers me much! And this seem to take
too much energy instead of fixing real bugs.
The UI was developed by KDE, no longer is. therefore we cannot continue
using their name or conventions. We need to respect the KDE e.v and their
wishes as well.
And by the way pronounciation of TDE sounds
awkward... So I'm all
against it. Though I am just a user.
and Guh-Nome and Kay-Dee_Eeh sound better? I think the best solution is to
just call it Trinity Desktop :)
10:18 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 4:44 PM, Calvin Morrison <mutantturkey(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Oh, about pronounciation it is my Russian experience that I forgot to
take into account. Excuse me! On Russian it sounds pretty well 'Gnom'
and 'KaDeYe'. :)) But 'TeDeYe' is funny! :)
On 16 December 2011 07:16, Aleksey Midenkov
<midenok(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Not from the point of view of regular user such as myself. For me KDE
is not firm, not some organisation of people. For me KDE is just the
name of program (or suite of programs to be strict). A name that I
used for many years. And will use it because everyone knows what is
KDE3.5 and not many know what is TDE. And when I say TDE, I need to
explain that it is the same as KDE3.5 (with a few bugs fixed, few bugs
added).
Is it registered trademark, btw? Is it against law and against wish of
KDE group (really?) to keep the name of program as it were? Why
someone should relate KDE 3.6 to KDE group if it will be written that
it is supported by Trinity group?
And you corrected me that it was developed. Of course it were. It is
just my English mistake. But it is still UI that was developed by KDE.
And there will be no cardinal changes (if there will be any chages at
all). It will be KDE UI on 99.9%. Otherwise there is no sense for this
project.
I might be a very ignorant in this topic. But I don't see a
justification for the rebranding. The product is *still* KDE on 99.9%
with a few bugs fixed. If there will be some large but hidden changes
like moving from HAL to UDEV, moving from DCOP to DBUS, XDG
compliance, etc. It will be *still* KDE user experience.
Similar code, but it is nNo longer a KDE product
The UI is
developed by KDE and the UI is that is valued most here. So this fuss
about replacement of K with T bothers me much! And this seem to take
too much energy instead of fixing real bugs.
The UI was developed by KDE, no longer is. therefore we cannot continue
using their name or conventions. We need to respect the KDE e.v and their
wishes as well.
And by the way pronounciation of TDE sounds
awkward... So I'm all
against it. Though I am just a user.
and Guh-Nome and Kay-Dee_Eeh sound better? I think the best solution is to
just call it Trinity Desktop :)
Calvin Morrison
10:41 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
<snip>
Is it registered trademark, btw?
Yes.
Is it against law and against wish of
KDE group (really?) to keep the name of program as it were?
Yes.
Why
someone should relate KDE 3.6 to KDE group if it will be written that
it is supported by Trinity group?
KDE wishes to be associated with the new KDE4 user interface and plasma
experience, not the "old" KDE3 interface and traditional desktop
computing. By respecting this, we avoid a lot of potential strife and
confusion between the KDE and TDE projects.
Remember that for the majority of people a name is a *unique* identifier.
KDE cannot refer to two completely different systems designed around
incompatible HCI models without causing considerable confusion.
Tim
7:26 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Friday 16 December 2011 02:19:50 Darrell Anderson wrote:
My two cents about the logo is I like the current logo
with the gears and
T. The logo shows our roots to KDE3 but maintains a separate identity.
agreed.
I am not concerned with goofballs misinterpreting what
Trinity means. Just
about any name can be perceived by fanatics as meaning something
"sinister."
One rabbi and one blogger have their heads stuffed where the sun doesn't
shine. That is not a loss of market share.
+1
werner
7:24 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Friday 16 December 2011 01:41:43 Calvin Morrison wrote:
A "planet" - basically it's a feed for
all of our different blogs into one
page.
good idea, think of e.g. http://planetkde.org/ which can easyly be followed
via akregator.
werner
19 Dec
19 Dec
10:18 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 02:20:28 +0100
L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Okay, it took a little longer than I had hoped. So sue me. Here are nine
miscellaneous logo mockups:
http://postimage.org/image/5g0xh97rr/
To the best of my knowledge, none of these has any religious connotations
unless you want to really stretch things (I did use a gear in a couple of them,
but it was carefully designed not to look like the KDE gear). I've placed them
on faux-menu-buttons because the menu button is the context in which most
users will be seeing the logo most often. Colours and some details could
still use adjustment. In addition to "three" and the letter T, I used
"fast" (also,
"flourishing") as a keyword to work from.
The originals are Inkscape SVG, and if anyone wants to play with them, I
can make the file available.
(My favourites? The tree on the bottom left, the triangle on the middle-right,
and the sorta-triskele on the bottom right.)
2011/12/15 E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com>
If there's
no great hurry, I may try my hand at sketching something
over the next few days . . .
Your sketches will be more than welcome. And there is
no hurry, since
I need to gather my ideas for whole structure of website, not only for
layout.
10:24 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
I like the tree one. It has connotations of
wisdom, sturdiness and timelessness. Unlike
certain other desktop systems for Linux.
- Nigel
11:16 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
2011/12/19 Nigel Stewart <nigels.com(a)gmail.com>om>:
Couting from left to right, from top to
bottom I like: 6,7,9
20 Dec
20 Dec
3:24 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
Le lundi 19 décembre 2011, L0ner sh4dou a écrit :
2011/12/19 Nigel Stewart
<nigels.com(a)gmail.com>om>:
Couting from left to right, from top
to bottom I like: 6,7,9
--------------------------------------------
Hello. Very nice job. 1, 6, 7 and 9, for me.
4:15 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On 20 December 2011 10:24, Patrick Serru <patrick(a)serru.net> wrote:
Le lundi 19 décembre 2011, L0ner sh4dou a écrit :
I like the Tree. Wisdom.
2011/12/19 Nigel Stewart
<nigels.com(a)gmail.com>om>:
Couting from left to right, from top
to bottom I like: 6,7,9
--------------------------------------------
Hello. Very nice job. 1, 6, 7 and 9, for me.
19 Dec
19 Dec
11:31 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
Okay, it took a little longer than I had hoped. So
sue me. Here are nine
miscellaneous logo mockups:
http://postimage.org/image/5g0xh97rr/
Very nice! Professional looking too. :)
I like the one with the gears to maintain a connection to KDE3 historical roots. If the
majority vote to move to a new logo then I think the light blue of the old KDE3 logo can
help maintain roots to KDE3.
I like the current logo but if a new direction is what others want then that is fine with
me. All of these logos look good. :)
Darrell
17 Jan
17 Jan
1:46 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 10:18 PM, E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 02:20:28 +0100
L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Okay, it took a little longer than I had hoped. So sue me. Here are nine
miscellaneous logo mockups:
http://postimage.org/image/5g0xh97rr/
These seem a bit to complex to pass as a logo. As been discussed recently
about the icon set, it would be important to keep Crystal SVG and has such
have a logo that blends well together style and color wise with the
existing theme. Perhaps toning down on the reflections would also help with
visual recognition of the logo. I think it is important that whatever comes
out of this thread is easily used from 16x16 up to 256x256 pixels, though
that is not always possible.
I also rather liked sh4dou's 1st sketch.
Best regards,
Tiago
2011/12/15 E. Liddell
<ejlddll(a)googlemail.com>
If
there's no great hurry, I may try my hand at sketching something
over the next few days . . .
Your sketches will be more than welcome. And there is
no hurry, since
I need to gather my ideas for whole structure of website, not only for
layout. To the best of my knowledge, none of these has any
religious connotations
unless you want to really stretch things (I did use a gear in a couple of
them,
but it was carefully designed not to look like the KDE gear). I've placed
them
on faux-menu-buttons because the menu button is the context in which most
users will be seeing the logo most often. Colours and some details could
still use adjustment. In addition to "three" and the letter T, I used
"fast" (also,
"flourishing") as a keyword to work from.
The originals are Inkscape SVG, and if anyone wants to play with them, I
can make the file available.
(My favourites? The tree on the bottom left, the triangle on the
middle-right,
and the sorta-triskele on the bottom right.)
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2:43 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Tue, 17 Jan 2012 01:46:48 +0000
Tiago Marques <tiagomnm(a)gmail.com> wrote:
On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 10:18 PM, E. Liddell
<ejlddll(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
I am forced to ask--did you actually try scaling them? The tree, triangle, and
triskele designs, which received the most votes, remain recognizable at 16x16
(little details like the tree's leaves and the triskele's loops are inevitably
lost,
but the overall shapes remain clear). Details like colour and reflection are
easy to change--it's the basic shape that's important in a logo.
Based on your reaction, I suspect that what I presented actually looks
too finished. That's my fault, though--really, I know better.
On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 02:20:28 +0100
L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Okay, it took a little longer than I had hoped. So sue me. Here are nine
miscellaneous logo mockups:
http://postimage.org/image/5g0xh97rr/
These seem a bit to complex to pass as a logo. As been discussed recently
about the icon set, it would be important to keep Crystal SVG and has such
have a logo that blends well together style and color wise with the
existing theme. Perhaps toning down on the reflections would also help with
visual recognition of the logo. I think it is important that whatever comes
out of this thread is easily used from 16x16 up to 256x256 pixels, though
that is not always possible. 2011/12/15 E. Liddell
<ejlddll(a)googlemail.com>
If
there's no great hurry, I may try my hand at sketching something
over the next few days . . .
Your sketches will be more than welcome. And there is
no hurry, since
I need to gather my ideas for whole structure of website, not only for
layout. I also rather liked sh4dou's 1st sketch.
I think this is the heart of the matter. Eventually, someone's going to have
to tally the votes and hand them over to Timothy for a decision, but I
don't think there's any hurry.
18 Jan
18 Jan
11:37 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
I didn't scale it, no. That's a bigger issue though, as you can see from
Crystal SVG some cards have different versions for smaller icons, to
improve the icon's clarity. Sometimes it's warranted, sometimes it's not.
Based on your reaction, I suspect that what I presented actually looks
too finished. That's my fault, though--really, I know better.
I mean that I thought these were final designs?
Best regards,
Tiago
On Tue, Jan 17, 2012 at 2:43 PM, E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
On Tue, 17 Jan 2012 01:46:48 +0000
Tiago Marques <tiagomnm(a)gmail.com> wrote:
such
On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 10:18 PM, E. Liddell
<ejlddll(a)googlemail.com>
wrote:
> On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 02:20:28 +0100
> L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > 2011/12/15 E. Liddell <ejlddll(a)googlemail.com>
>
> > >If there's no great hurry, I may try my hand at sketching something
> > >over the next few days . . .
> > Your sketches will be more than welcome. And there is no hurry, since
> > I need to gather my ideas for whole structure of website, not only
for
> > layout.
>
> Okay, it took a little longer than I had hoped. So sue me. Here are
nine
miscellaneous logo mockups:
http://postimage.org/image/5g0xh97rr/
These seem a bit to complex to pass as a logo. As been discussed recently
about the icon set, it would be important to keep Crystal SVG and has have a logo that blends well together style and
color wise with the
existing theme. Perhaps toning down on the reflections would also help
with
visual recognition of the logo. I think it is
important that whatever
comes
out of this thread is easily used from 16x16 up
to 256x256 pixels, though
that is not always possible.
I am forced to ask--did you actually try scaling them? The tree, triangle,
and
triskele designs, which received the most votes, remain recognizable at
16x16
(little details like the tree's leaves and the triskele's loops are
inevitably lost,
but the overall shapes remain clear). Details like colour and reflection
are
easy to change--it's the basic shape that's important in a logo.
Based on your reaction, I suspect that what I presented actually looks
too finished. That's my fault, though--really, I know better.
I also rather liked sh4dou's 1st sketch.
I think this is the heart of the matter. Eventually, someone's going to
have
to tally the votes and hand them over to Timothy for a decision, but I
don't think there's any hurry.
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Please remember not to top-post:
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19 Jan
19 Jan
2:25 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 23:37:49 +0000
Tiago Marques <tiagomnm(a)gmail.com> wrote:
It's something they warn you against in design school: presenting something
that looks too finished at an early stage can convince the client that all aspects
of the design are already set in stone. In this case, everything I posted was
a first draft--just a very polished-looking one--and I'm quite happy to make
changes if anyone has any specific complaints.
It might not be a bad idea to follow the suggestion made in one of the other
threads and repost the current set of logo candidates--both mine and
sh4dou's--to the users' list and ask for votes/comments/other candidates
(after all, logo design doesn't require coding skills!), but I'm too tired to do
it tonight.
I didn't scale it, no. That's a bigger issue
though, as you can see from
Crystal SVG some cards have different versions for smaller icons, to
improve the icon's clarity. Sometimes it's warranted, sometimes it's not.
Regardless, this is something to worry about after a final selection is made.
Based on your
reaction, I suspect that what I presented actually looks
too finished. That's my fault, though--really, I know better.
I mean that I thought these were final designs?
15 Dec
15 Dec
12:19 a.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Trinity logo?
On Wed, 14 Dec 2011 23:57:28 +0100
L0ner sh4dou <sh4dou(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Since I'm trying to come up with an idea for new
[a little more
modern, and not looking like it was made in 2003 (no offense to
creator intended)] Trinity website I'd like some help. What I need is
a logo, a symbol for Trinity. And one that is not religious (since the
name was understood as a religious one once). The current logo is a
no-no IMO since it's a too big reference to the KDE logo (gears) and
it just kde3.5 logo with a "T" instead of "K". It should be
something
simple and easy to remember.
I know I might be demanding too much, but I think it's a good idea to
come up with something together.
Hmmm . . . Maybe something involving a triangle, to emphasise the
whole "three" notion (which would hopefully connect the word
"trinity"
back to something other than religion)? Also, might it perhaps be of
benefit to choose colours different from those favoured by the KDE
project (even if it's just a different blue, like navy or teal)?
If there's no great hurry, I may try my hand at sketching something
over the next few days . . .
4480
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66 comments
14 participants
participants (14)
-
/dev/ammo42 -
Aleksey Midenkov -
Calvin Morrison -
Darrell Anderson -
E. Liddell -
L0ner sh4dou -
Marvin L Jones -
Nicolas Bercher -
Nigel Stewart -
Patrick Serru -
Robert Xu -
Tiago Marques -
Timothy Pearson -
Werner Joss