Hello,
I've seen many calls for a stand alone Konqueror. I have seen people who do not want to use KDE3 anymore, but desperately miss their beloved Konqueror asking for it. What do you all think about creating just a Konqueror tarball for the releases, and push it out to package maintainers?
Frankly Konqueror is the best manager around, I think we might as well get people hooked on it :)
Calvin Morrison
On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 1:05 PM, Calvin Morrison mutantturkey@gmail.com wrote:
Hello,
I've seen many calls for a stand alone Konqueror. I have seen people who do not want to use KDE3 anymore, but desperately miss their beloved Konqueror asking for it. What do you all think about creating just a Konqueror tarball for the releases, and push it out to package maintainers?
Frankly Konqueror is the best manager around, I think we might as well get people hooked on it :)
Calvin Morrison
If you added Kate and Konsole to that I would love it.... <grin>
I also think you are right about getting people hooked.
Keith
On 19 December 2011 13:07, Keith Daniels keithwdaniels@gmail.com wrote:
On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 1:05 PM, Calvin Morrison mutantturkey@gmail.com wrote:
Hello,
I've seen many calls for a stand alone Konqueror. I have seen people who
do
not want to use KDE3 anymore, but desperately miss their beloved
Konqueror
asking for it. What do you all think about creating just a Konqueror
tarball
for the releases, and push it out to package maintainers?
Frankly Konqueror is the best manager around, I think we might as well
get
people hooked on it :)
Calvin Morrison
If you added Kate and Konsole to that I would love it.... <grin>
I also think you are right about getting people hooked.
Keith
the old archlinux kde3 project called kdemod3 actually did this. Everything was modularized so you only had to install what you wanted. We are planning on doing this with our Arch Linux packages now. Pawel is heading up that front.
Wonderful.... and I had decided to convert to Arch before I even heard this.
Keith
On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 1:14 PM, Calvin Morrison mutantturkey@gmail.com wrote:
On 19 December 2011 13:07, Keith Daniels keithwdaniels@gmail.com wrote:
On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 1:05 PM, Calvin Morrison mutantturkey@gmail.com wrote:
Hello,
I've seen many calls for a stand alone Konqueror. I have seen people who do not want to use KDE3 anymore, but desperately miss their beloved Konqueror asking for it. What do you all think about creating just a Konqueror tarball for the releases, and push it out to package maintainers?
Frankly Konqueror is the best manager around, I think we might as well get people hooked on it :)
Calvin Morrison
If you added Kate and Konsole to that I would love it.... <grin>
I also think you are right about getting people hooked.
Keith
the old archlinux kde3 project called kdemod3 actually did this. Everything was modularized so you only had to install what you wanted. We are planning on doing this with our Arch Linux packages now. Pawel is heading up that front.
Calvin Morrison wrote:
On 19 December 2011 13:07, Keith Daniels keithwdaniels@gmail.com wrote:
On Mon, Dec 19, 2011 at 1:05 PM, Calvin Morrison mutantturkey@gmail.com wrote:
Hello,
I've seen many calls for a stand alone Konqueror. I have seen people who
do
not want to use KDE3 anymore, but desperately miss their beloved
Konqueror
asking for it. What do you all think about creating just a Konqueror
tarball
for the releases, and push it out to package maintainers?
Frankly Konqueror is the best manager around, I think we might as well
get
people hooked on it :)
Calvin Morrison
If you added Kate and Konsole to that I would love it.... <grin>
I also think you are right about getting people hooked.
Keith
the old archlinux kde3 project called kdemod3 actually did this. Everything was modularized so you only had to install what you wanted. We are planning on doing this with our Arch Linux packages now. Pawel is heading up that front.
All I can say is that it takes a large subset of kdelibs/kdebase to do that:
$ ldd konqueror |grep trin libkdeinit_konqueror.so => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdeinit_konqueror.so libkonq.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkonq.so.4 libkutils.so.1 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkutils.so.1 libkparts.so.2 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkparts.so.2 libkio.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkio.so.4 libkdeui.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdeui.so.4 libkdesu.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdesu.so.4 libkwalletclient.so.1 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkwalletclient.so.1 libkdecore.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdecore.so.4 libDCOP.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libDCOP.so.4 libkdefx.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdefx.so.4 libtqt.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libtqt.so.4
$ ldd konsole |grep trin libkdeinit_konsole.so => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdeinit_konsole.so libkdeprint.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdeprint.so.4 libkio.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkio.so.4 libkdeui.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdeui.so.4 libkdesu.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdesu.so.4 libkwalletclient.so.1 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkwalletclient.so.1 libkdecore.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdecore.so.4 libDCOP.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libDCOP.so.4 libkdefx.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdefx.so.4 libtqt.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libtqt.so.4
All I can say is that it is not a simple proposition. One person wants konqueror, another wants konsole and kate, yet another will want something else. Disk space is pretty cheap. It seems like a lot of work for little advantage.
-- Bruce
All I can say is that it takes a large subset of kdelibs/kdebase to do that:
$ ldd konqueror |grep trin libkdeinit_konqueror.so => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdeinit_konqueror.so libkonq.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkonq.so.4 libkutils.so.1 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkutils.so.1 libkparts.so.2 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkparts.so.2 libkio.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkio.so.4 libkdeui.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdeui.so.4 libkdesu.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdesu.so.4 libkwalletclient.so.1 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkwalletclient.so.1 libkdecore.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdecore.so.4 libDCOP.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libDCOP.so.4 libkdefx.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdefx.so.4 libtqt.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libtqt.so.4
All of these are included in kdelibs, therefore not requiring kdebase at all.
All I can say is that it is not a simple proposition. One person wants
konqueror, another wants konsole and kate, yet another will want something else. Disk space is pretty cheap. It seems like a lot of work for little advantage.
I am aware that it does drag in a hefty bit of libraries. Here is a quote from a user who mentioned this on reddit today:
"So? Start with Trinity, strip away everything that isn't needed for Konqueror 3 functionality, and package it? I don't *care* if the end result is half a Gig in size - that doesn't matter. The functionality does"
Essentially Konqueror doesn't need the rest of tdebase, and most of what it depends on is from tdelibs. What it does depend on can be packaged in with it.
Konqueror on my machine pulls in 72 different libraries, as a comparison, firefox pulls in at 57 and mplayer at 142
I think it might be worth considering,
Calvin Morrison
Calvin Morrison wrote:
Essentially Konqueror doesn't need the rest of tdebase, and most of what it depends on is from tdelibs. What it does depend on can be packaged in with it.
Konqueror on my machine pulls in 72 different libraries, as a comparison, firefox pulls in at 57 and mplayer at 142
I think it might be worth considering,
You are aware that you can run Konqueror on a non-Trinity window manager, right? What does all this work to repackage do? Save a little disk space and download bandwidth. How much? Is it worth it? Compared to most YouTube views, the disk space and BW for installing all the base commands are negligible.
To me, the cost/benefit is too low, but someone might want to do it.
--- Bruce
Calvin Morrison wrote:
Essentially Konqueror doesn't need the rest of tdebase, and most of what it depends on is from tdelibs. What it does depend on can be packaged in with it.
Konqueror on my machine pulls in 72 different libraries, as a comparison, firefox pulls in at 57 and mplayer at 142
I think it might be worth considering,
You are aware that you can run Konqueror on a non-Trinity window manager, right? What does all this work to repackage do? Save a little disk space and download bandwidth. How much? Is it worth it? Compared to most YouTube views, the disk space and BW for installing all the base commands are negligible.
To me, the cost/benefit is too low, but someone might want to do it.
Exactly. Cost/benefit WAY too low for consideration by the general TDE project. If a distribution wants to do this "on the side" they are free to do so. ;-)
Tim
On 19 December 2011 14:13, Timothy Pearson kb9vqf@pearsoncomputing.netwrote:
Calvin Morrison wrote:
Essentially Konqueror doesn't need the rest of tdebase, and most of what it depends on is from tdelibs. What it does depend on can be packaged in with it.
Konqueror on my machine pulls in 72 different libraries, as a comparison, firefox pulls in at 57 and mplayer at 142
I think it might be worth considering,
You are aware that you can run Konqueror on a non-Trinity window manager, right? What does all this work to repackage do? Save a little disk space and download bandwidth. How much? Is it worth it? Compared to most YouTube views, the disk space and BW for installing all the base commands are negligible.
To me, the cost/benefit is too low, but someone might want to do it.
Exactly. Cost/benefit WAY too low for consideration by the general TDE project. If a distribution wants to do this "on the side" they are free to do so. ;-)
Tim
Okay,
Me and Pawel "L0ner" have been discussing the modularization of trinity applications that belong in kdebase/kdegrahpics/kdenetwork etc. They are almost all independent applications, and could be seperated as such.
Just trying to throw something fresh on the table, Calvin Morrison
2011/12/19 Calvin Morrison mutantturkey@gmail.com:
All I can say is that it takes a large subset of kdelibs/kdebase to do that:
$ ldd konqueror |grep trin libkdeinit_konqueror.so => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdeinit_konqueror.so libkonq.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkonq.so.4 libkutils.so.1 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkutils.so.1 libkparts.so.2 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkparts.so.2 libkio.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkio.so.4 libkdeui.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdeui.so.4 libkdesu.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdesu.so.4 libkwalletclient.so.1 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkwalletclient.so.1 libkdecore.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdecore.so.4 libDCOP.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libDCOP.so.4 libkdefx.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libkdefx.so.4 libtqt.so.4 => /opt/trinity/lib/libtqt.so.4
All of these are included in kdelibs, therefore not requiring kdebase at all.
All I can say is that it is not a simple proposition. One person wants konqueror, another wants konsole and kate, yet another will want something else. Disk space is pretty cheap. It seems like a lot of work for little advantage.
I am aware that it does drag in a hefty bit of libraries. Here is a quote from a user who mentioned this on reddit today:
"So? Start with Trinity, strip away everything that isn't needed for Konqueror 3 functionality, and package it? I don't *care* if the end result is half a Gig in size - that doesn't matter. The functionality does"
Essentially Konqueror doesn't need the rest of tdebase, and most of what it depends on is from tdelibs. What it does depend on can be packaged in with it.
Konqueror on my machine pulls in 72 different libraries, as a comparison, firefox pulls in at 57 and mplayer at 142
I think it might be worth considering,
Calvin Morrison
Besides, through modularizations we allow users to choose what actually goes in their system. I think it's a good idea.
I am aware that it does drag in a hefty bit of libraries. Here is a quote from a user who mentioned this on reddit today:
"So? Start with Trinity, strip away everything that isn't needed for Konqueror 3 functionality, and package it? I don't *care* if the end result is half a Gig in size - that doesn't matter. The functionality does"
Essentially Konqueror doesn't need the rest of tdebase, and most of what it depends on is from tdelibs. What it does depend on can be packaged in with it. Konqueror on my machine pulls in 72 different libraries, as a comparison, firefox pulls in at 57 and mplayer at 142 I think it might be worth considering,
A common complaint I read often in reviews is from people wanting to use a sole notable KDE app in a GTK environment is using that one app requires loading several KDE related libraries. Amarok, Digikam, etc. Same complaint will be heard with Konqueror. :)
Of course, I dislike using GTK apps in KDE3/TDE. :)
One of the significant reasons I remain with KDE3/TDE is Konqueror as a file manager. Offering the app as a stand alone is an interesting topic but is the goal worth the effort? People running GTK desktops are unlikely to be motivated. People running GNOME or Unity are unlikely to be motivated. People running KDE4 are unlikely to be motivated.
I'm not against the idea. Just saying the payback might be nominal at best. :)
With that said, as an R15 priority I VERY MUCH would like to see a move toward modularizing TDE. That move would reduce build and debugging issues and could very well help your idea too.
Darrell
the old archlinux kde3 project called kdemod3 actually did this. Everything was modularized so you only had to install what you wanted. We are planning on doing this with our Arch Linux packages now. Pawel is heading up that front.
As an R15 priority I VERY MUCH would like to see a move toward modularizing TDE. That move would reduce build and debugging issues and could very well induce people to download specific TDE packages.
Please share this information with the dev team!
Darrell
-
Bruce Dubbs -
Calvin Morrison -
Darrell Anderson -
Keith Daniels -
L0ner sh4dou -
Timothy Pearson