3 Dec
2015
3 Dec
'15
10:10 a.m.
Hi all,
as many of you may have followed the discussion in the user list regarding a
syncing with mobile phone and other mobile devices, I would like to open a
discussion on that subject as it looks like we have a base (TDEPIM) but no
decent way to answer the recent developments in the mobile scene.
Is someone here willing to help round up a plan what needs to be done to
cover the aspects in the context of TDE and TDEPIM.
I'm sure all of us use some kind of mobile devices that can be synced with
each other - and it would be a great great idea to have it in TDE.
Unfortunately I dropped any work perhaps in 2010 and did not follow up the
further development of akonadi. I still follow the syncevolution. Opensync
works great except the syncML protocol, which turned out to be crucial in
terms of mobile devices.
I don't know what tablets use and especially the Jolla one I would like to
buy.
I also don't know what are the plans in TDE. I recall I read somewhere that
there is a plan to make use of the newest Qt and KDE4/5 libraries.
I would appreciate any help drafting the steps to bring us to a working
solution as it looks like TDE is indeed realy good and useful to all of us.
I can speak of myself only and I use it private and for business with a
great success.
Thank you in advance
3 Dec
3 Dec
5:46 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] TDEPIM status and possibility to extend it to support syncevolution
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Hi all,
as many of you may have followed the discussion in the user list regarding
a
syncing with mobile phone and other mobile devices, I would like to open a
discussion on that subject as it looks like we have a base (TDEPIM) but no
decent way to answer the recent developments in the mobile scene.
Is someone here willing to help round up a plan what needs to be done to
cover the aspects in the context of TDE and TDEPIM.
I'm sure all of us use some kind of mobile devices that can be synced with
each other - and it would be a great great idea to have it in TDE.
Unfortunately I dropped any work perhaps in 2010 and did not follow up the
further development of akonadi. I still follow the syncevolution. Opensync
works great except the syncML protocol, which turned out to be crucial in
terms of mobile devices.
I don't know what tablets use and especially the Jolla one I would like to
buy.
I also don't know what are the plans in TDE. I recall I read somewhere
that
there is a plan to make use of the newest Qt and KDE4/5 libraries.
I would appreciate any help drafting the steps to bring us to a working
solution as it looks like TDE is indeed realy good and useful to all of
us.
I can speak of myself only and I use it private and for business with a
great success.
Thank you in advance
I would be interested in seeing tdepim stabilized and brought up to modern
standards. I was the last one to make any major changes to that codebase,
adding carddav/caldav support, which unfortunately has bitrotted some over
the years due to general lack of interest.
As I don't generally use / sync mobile devices for various security and
privacy reasons I don't know what would need to be done to get this
working correctly. What is your general use case?
Thanks!
Tim
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6:41 p.m.
Timothy Pearson wrote:
As I don't generally use / sync mobile devices for
various security and
privacy reasons I don't know what would need to be done to get this
working correctly. What is your general use case?
Thanks for the reply!
My problem is (I don't know if use case is appropriate), that I was able to
sync my phone and Palm III without issue until 2005. Palm broke and phone
was replaced some time after and sync stopped working, because newer phones
were using SyncML already.
I'm not sure what you mean by saying privacy - I want to have my events,
notes, todos in sync on TDE and my phone - I don't see any problem if I
sync up via USB cable between PC and phone.
So I am looking for a way to sync up few devices. Tablet, 2xPhones, TDE etc.
What should be synced is the trivial once (cal, event, address, todo,
notes) and possibly all the rest possible to be synced via syncML (images,
mp3 etc - but this is nice to have - I'm sure it will work as the syncml
library is pretty good - we just miss an interface in TDE for it).
I have to ask/check Jolla what kind of protocol they offer.
I tried to prepare myself for KDE4 ~2010 but found out that neither KDE4 nor
the opensync were going to work properly with SyncML. I have ported/updated
KDEPIM to use akonadi and opensync, which is usable in some extend, but not
with syncML. After a discussion with syncevo leader and looking into the
SyncML protocol I finally understood that the only way is to get advantage
of the syncevo engine and do some kind of interface on top that would fit
TDE ... might be tdepim and kitchensync or whatever - might be something
new.
From what I have seen there are also few other candidates that can be
updated - I mean use the interface and replace the old code below
I hope this gives an idea
regards
7:27 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Re: TDEPIM status and possibility to extend it to support syncevolution
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Timothy Pearson wrote:
And from my perspective I wouldn't ever want my private notes uploaded to
the NSA/<other three letter agency>/Google/<other corporate busybody> over
the baseband connection after they are on the phone. That's generally
private information (raw unfiltered thoughts), similar to the contents of
a personal diary, that in a civilised society only I should ever see.
When anyone else starts reading your raw unfiltered thoughts, especially
when those same entities can take action against you, it introduces severe
chilling effects across the entire population that are long-term damaging
to democratic societies.
tl;dr: I never put anything on a phone that hasn't been thoroughly thought
through and is ready for public scrutiny. It's an old policy, and one
that has unfortunately been proven correct over the years. Now Microsoft
is even snooping through everyone's personal files looking for who knows
what to make money.
As I don't generally use / sync mobile
devices for various security and
privacy reasons I don't know what would need to be done to get this
working correctly. What is your general use case?
Thanks for the reply!
My problem is (I don't know if use case is appropriate), that I was able
to
sync my phone and Palm III without issue until 2005. Palm broke and phone
was replaced some time after and sync stopped working, because newer
phones
were using SyncML already.
I'm not sure what you mean by saying privacy - I want to have my events,
notes, todos in sync on TDE and my phone - I don't see any problem if I
sync up via USB cable between PC and phone. So I am looking for a way to sync up few devices.
Tablet, 2xPhones, TDE
etc.
What should be synced is the trivial once (cal, event, address, todo,
notes) and possibly all the rest possible to be synced via syncML (images,
mp3 etc - but this is nice to have - I'm sure it will work as the syncml
library is pretty good - we just miss an interface in TDE for it).
I am unfamiliar with syncML. Do any of these phones / sync solutions use
a standard interface (similar to CalDAV, CardDAV, etc.) or are they all
proprietary / device class specific APIs?
Thanks!
Tim
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7:47 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Re: TDEPIM status and possibility to extend it to support syncevolution
On Thursday 03 of December 2015 20:27:11 Timothy Pearson wrote:
As far as I know, SyncML went into oblivion just because it was very
differently implemented in different devices. I personally consider SyncML as
the history that is no longer promising.
Current devices usually use CalDAV / CardDAV or ActiveSync or both. For
example, there's an application for Android - DAVDroid, which is being
developed as opensource. That's why I want to focus on solving problems
CalDAV and CardDAV in TDE.
--
Slávek
So I am
looking for a way to sync up few devices. Tablet, 2xPhones, TDE
etc.
What should be synced is the trivial once (cal, event, address, todo,
notes) and possibly all the rest possible to be synced via syncML
(images, mp3 etc - but this is nice to have - I'm sure it will work as
the syncml library is pretty good - we just miss an interface in TDE for
it).
I am unfamiliar with syncML. Do any of these phones / sync solutions use
a standard interface (similar to CalDAV, CardDAV, etc.) or are they all
proprietary / device class specific APIs?
Thanks!
Tim
8:32 p.m.
Slávek Banko wrote:
On Thursday 03 of December 2015 20:27:11 Timothy
Pearson wrote:
As far as I know, SyncML went into oblivion just because it was very
differently implemented in different devices. I personally consider SyncML
as the history that is no longer promising.
Current devices usually use CalDAV / CardDAV or ActiveSync or both. For
example, there's an application for Android - DAVDroid, which is being
developed as opensource. That's why I want to focus on solving problems
CalDAV and CardDAV in TDE.
Thanks Slavek,
this is why I opened the discussion here. As I mentioned I dropped my work
on this couple of years ago and I don't know how far it went on.
I'm sure the N9 uses SyncML and I'm sure why it works good. Unfortunately
there is no way for sync with TDE. It is a pain to do it with some tricks
etc.
I'll check the details on the N9 and the Jolla device and will try to update
my knowledge set.
It looks like I have to pull tdepim source. Which is the best way to get all
relevant packages?
This is what I see on my machine
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 kontact-trinity
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 libkpimexchange1-trinity
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 libkpimexchange1-trinity-dev
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 libkpimidentities1-trinity
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 libtdepim1-trinity-dev
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 libtdepim1a-trinity
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 tdepim-tdefile-plugins-trinity
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 tdepim-tdeio-plugins-trinity
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 tdepim-tderesources-trinity
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 tdepim-trinity
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 tdepim-trinity-dev
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 tdepim-wizards-trinity
4:14.0.2-0debian8.0.0+0 kitchensync-trinity
regards
So I am
looking for a way to sync up few devices. Tablet, 2xPhones, TDE
etc.
What should be synced is the trivial once (cal, event, address, todo,
notes) and possibly all the rest possible to be synced via syncML
(images, mp3 etc - but this is nice to have - I'm sure it will work as
the syncml library is pretty good - we just miss an interface in TDE
for it).
I am unfamiliar with syncML. Do any of these phones / sync solutions use
a standard interface (similar to CalDAV, CardDAV, etc.) or are they all
proprietary / device class specific APIs?
Thanks!
Tim 
5 Dec
5 Dec
12:33 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Re: TDEPIM status and possibility to extend it to support syncevolution
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Hash: SHA512
On 2015/12/04 03:47 AM, Slávek Banko wrote:
On Thursday 03 of December 2015 20:27:11 Timothy
Pearson wrote:
As far as I know, SyncML went into oblivion just because it was very differently
implemented in different devices.
I personally consider SyncML as the history that is no longer promising.
Current devices usually use CalDAV / CardDAV or ActiveSync or both. For example,
there's an application for Android
- DAVDroid, which is being developed as opensource. That's why I want to focus on
solving problems CalDAV and
CardDAV in TDE.
I also don't sync my phone or any other device for the same reasons Tim explained in
details.
But I think it would be a good addition (perhaps a -must have- one these days) to TDE
since most of the general users
would surely use it.
If we identify a proper way forward (required protocols and interfaces) we could look at
integrating them into TDE.
Cheers
Michele
So I am
looking for a way to sync up few devices. Tablet, 2xPhones, TDE etc. What should be synced
is the
trivial once (cal, event, address, todo, notes) and possibly all the rest possible to be
synced via syncML
(images, mp3 etc - but this is nice to have - I'm sure it will work as the syncml
library is pretty good - we
just miss an interface in TDE for it).
I am unfamiliar with syncML. Do any of these phones / sync solutions use a standard
interface (similar to
CalDAV, CardDAV, etc.) or are they all proprietary / device class specific APIs?
Thanks!
Tim -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
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12:33 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Re: TDEPIM status and possibility to extend it to support syncevolution
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On 2015/12/04 03:47 AM, Slávek Banko wrote:
I also don't sync my phone or any other device for the same reasons Tim explained in
details.
But I think it would be a good addition (perhaps a -must have- one these days) to TDE
since most of the general users
would surely use it.
If we identify a proper way forward (required protocols and interfaces) we could look at
integrating them into TDE.
Cheers
Michele
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12:33 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Re: TDEPIM status and possibility to extend it to support syncevolution
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Hash: SHA512
On 2015/12/04 03:47 AM, Slávek Banko wrote:
I also don't sync my phone or any other device for the same reasons Tim explained in
details.
But I think it would be a good addition (perhaps a -must have- one these days) to TDE
since most of the general users
would surely use it.
If we identify a proper way forward (required protocols and interfaces) we could look at
integrating them into TDE.
Cheers
Michele
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2:11 p.m.
Michele Calgaro wrote:
If we identify a proper way forward (required
protocols and interfaces) w=
e could look at integrating them into TDE.
This could help understand what is the scope (at least for me)
https://jolla.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/201836827-How-do-I-move-contact…
Jolla and N9 support the MTP as well as Android AFAIK.
As I stated before I have lost track of all this around 2010, but it won't
be hard to catch up.
I think it would be possible to implement support in TDEPIM for the
syncevolution engine. MTP is working for me at the moment, but of course it
is not usable for contacts, events etc.
It would be really great to have this in TDE
Thanks in advance
regards
2:43 p.m.
New subject: [trinity-devel] Re: Re: TDEPIM status and possibility to extend it to support syncevolution
On Saturday 05 of December 2015 15:11:58 deloptes wrote:
Michele Calgaro wrote:
According to information about Jolla - also can use CalDAV and CardDAV
protocol. Therefore, it once again seems to be the most appropriate way to
use CalDAV and CardDAV. There are various server sides, which also offers
CalDAV and CardDAV. Already mentioned was SOGo and ownCloud. Others are
Horde, eGroupware, Zimbra, Kerio Connect, DavMail (gateway to MS Exchange)...
Nowadays I find it more convenient to deal with synchronization to the server
instead of a "local synchronization with computer."
--
Slávek
If we identify a proper way forward (required
protocols and interfaces)
w= e could look at integrating them into TDE.
This could help understand what is the scope (at least for me)
https://jolla.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/201836827-How-do-I-move-contact
s-to-Jolla-
Jolla and N9 support the MTP as well as Android AFAIK.
As I stated before I have lost track of all this around 2010, but it won't
be hard to catch up.
I think it would be possible to implement support in TDEPIM for the
syncevolution engine. MTP is working for me at the moment, but of course it
is not usable for contacts, events etc.
It would be really great to have this in TDE
Thanks in advance
regards
4:28 p.m.
Slávek Banko wrote:
Nowadays I find it more convenient to deal with
synchronization to the
server instead of a "local synchronization with computer."
Slavek I got your point, I hope you get mine as well. Just as you prefer
sync up with a server, I prefer sync up with the PC.
Your point is valid one and I do not think that our views contradict in some
way.
And yes it states it supports CalDAV/CardDAV, but I almost never use the
wireless or data access on my phone. I would prefer old fashion USB cable
or bluetooth also for the security reasons the gents mentioned above.
AFAIR syncevolution supports CalDAV/CardDAV as well, so wouldn't it be
better to just connect TDEPIM with syncevolution and let all the rest to
their support team?
I'm not advocating for syncevolution, but I'm not aware of any other engine
supporting SyncML with USB/Bluetooth.
I'm not sure, but I think we could extend kitchensync and let it use
whatever we offer in TDEPIM to use syncevo engine and this might be the
less effort path - but honestly I'm too far from being sure as I barely
know the status of TDEPIM and syncevolution ATM.
Where is the CalDEV/CardDEV part Timothy and you mentioned? What is the git
location?
regards
9 Dec
9 Dec
11:16 p.m.
Hi,
I've not heard anything from you on what to do with the TDEPIM.
I hope I have not insulted anyone.
I was thinking you could provide more insight as you definitely know the
KDE/TDE internals much much better than I do.
Can you estimate the effort in each direction - example if I want to have a
frontend for syncevolution - what needs to be done and how much time would
it require for avg programming skills?
From what I know there are limited ressources, so perhaps I should write it
myself, which means optimal time planning, so I just want to have an idea
of the volume of the dev work - what can be reused, which modules affected
etc - as much as possible :)
thanks in advance
3 Dec
3 Dec
8:21 p.m.
Timothy Pearson wrote:
Perhaps my knowledge is outdated, but still I can not get the contacts etc
between the N9 and TDE and I would love to.
I think the discussion is pretty useful. I'll jump down to the mail from
Slavek.
regards
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Hash: SHA224
Here I agree with you. This is why I do not use Microsoft, Apple or Google
devices and services.
Regarding the need to sync up information it is pretty clear. I want to have
same set of data (Contacts, Notes etc) on my devices and be able to modify
on one single place.
Timothy Pearson wrote:
And from my perspective I wouldn't ever want my private notes uploaded to
the NSA/<other three letter agency>/Google/<other corporate busybody> over
the baseband connection after they are on the phone. That's generally
private information (raw unfiltered thoughts), similar to the contents of
a personal diary, that in a civilised society only I should ever see.
When anyone else starts reading your raw unfiltered thoughts, especially
when those same entities can take action against you, it introduces severe
chilling effects across the entire population that are long-term damaging
to democratic societies.
tl;dr: I never put anything on a phone that hasn't been thoroughly thought
through and is ready for public scrutiny. It's an old policy, and one
that has unfortunately been proven correct over the years. Now Microsoft
is even snooping through everyone's personal files looking for who knows
what to make money. As I don't generally use / sync mobile
devices for various security and
privacy reasons I don't know what would need to be done to get this
working correctly. What is your general use case?
Thanks for the reply!
My problem is (I don't know if use case is appropriate), that I was able
to
sync my phone and Palm III without issue until 2005. Palm broke and phone
was replaced some time after and sync stopped working, because newer
phones
were using SyncML already.
I'm not sure what you mean by saying privacy - I want to have my events,
notes, todos in sync on TDE and my phone - I don't see any problem if I
sync up via USB cable between PC and phone. So I am looking for a way to sync up few devices.
Tablet, 2xPhones, TDE
etc.
What should be synced is the trivial once (cal, event, address, todo,
notes) and possibly all the rest possible to be synced via syncML
(images, mp3 etc - but this is nice to have - I'm sure it will work as
the syncml
library is pretty good - we just miss an interface in TDE for it).
I am unfamiliar with syncML. Do any of these phones / sync solutions use
a standard interface (similar to CalDAV, CardDAV, etc.) or are they all
proprietary / device class specific APIs?
12 Dec
12 Dec
1:39 p.m.
I just looked into the syncevolution code. It has a gtk based UI and the
backends.
I think the easiest way would be to write a tde backend and use the gtk UI
by opensync. This also means that the functionality will go into the
syncevolution project. Originally I was thinking one could integrate the
syncevolution into the existing tde, but from what I see it would be much
easier to provide an option for sync with tde from syncevolution.
Do you know if it is possible to write KPart for gtk application?
Thanks
regards
3298
days inactive
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participants (4)
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deloptes -
Michele Calgaro -
Slávek Banko -
Timothy Pearson