18 Sep
2014
18 Sep
'14
7:22 p.m.
Am Donnerstag, 18. September 2014 schrieb Curt Howland:
On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 12:21 PM, Mike Bird
<mgb-trinity(a)yosemite.net> wrote:
Just some system-rafiness from debian jessie:
Logfiles are binary. So you can't simply boot with a live disto and look at the
logfiles. Better even, there are no persistent logfiles by default. Well, who would care
to look at logfiles, anyway?
systemd/logind/journald/networkd/usersession share PID 1. Great, if somthing there goes
haywire you have to reboot the system, 'cause you cannot kill one of these processes
individually. On the other hand, who would ever have a system running more than a week,
now that it's booting so fast? Well, and for the Windows user we have implemented the
"reboot after upgrade"-feature at last. Now isn't that great?
Maybe these points are of no value for desktop users, but it's essential in my
business that systems run reliably and can quite well be fixed remotely. That's not
the case with systemd any more. It's diametrically to unix philosophy. It's more
like "One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them, One Ring to bring them all
and in the darkness bind them" than "Freedom of choice"
If systemd will become mandatory on Debian I already see myself packing things up and move
to an other Unix land. Well, hopefully TDE will work on FreeBSD or OpenBSD then :-)
Nik
--
Please do not email me anything that you are not comfortable also sharing with the NSA.
Gnu/Linux probably does need a new init, and
something along the
lines of the core 1% of systemd with optional cgroups support would
be a good approach.
Just like X, sysvinit was proclaimed in need of replacement many years
ago, for many reasons.
The problem is that the functionality of these packages has been built
over time to answer particular problems. Any new system is going to
have to go through exactly the same process, the slow evolution of
"Gee, I didn't think anyone used it for that."
Sysvinit allowed for parallel boot without changing "everything". And
it's especially good at being able to change pretty much any single
component without a reboot.
This kind of flexibility will, I believe, turn out to be more
important than the systemd developers believe it to be.
I will echo that, being just a user, I am happy to use whatever works.
I thank Tim and Slávek and others for making TDE
optionally work
with systemd without depending upon systemd - unlike Debian where
systemd proponents are frantically changing packages to unnecessarily
require systemd.
Indeed. Thank you.
Curt-