Howdy,
first of all thank you all for keeping KDE3 alive and kicking and for providing packages for the various distributions.
I finally got too fed up with Mandriva and was looking for a better alternative. OpenSuSE 12.1 is really great, but, alas, there are no trinity packages available, yet. Having seen the F15 and 16 packages I played with that. 3 days ago there was no F16 yet, so I downloaded the TDELIVEF15.iso and share my experience, which unfortunately goes for yesterday's release of the F16 live CD:
The CD is severely broken in many ways:
* Both CDs cannot launch the live installer from the desktop. It is therefore necessary to open a terminal, allow root to use the X-server by xhost + and start /usr/bin/liveinst manually.
* The setup cannot be completed, because the default runlevel is 3. One needs to log in as root and start init 5 to get to the window manager.
* TDE does not recognize one's old settings from a previous installation of KDE3. I have linked .kde3 to .kde in hy /home and I wonder whee those settings used to resid, or has TDE wiped my .kde? Not good.
* The F15 CD cannot even log into the display manager at all. It is missing a critical package: for PAM, some gnome package.
* The F15 CD misses the critical step of adding a regular user. I needed to manually adduser.
* I can't get compiz to work at all, no matter what window decorator I use, neither gtk nor KDE4 works. I wish you would add the older compiz 8.6 to trinity, together with kde3-window-decorator.
* Laptop management is totally broken. The ACPI-helper setup uses an Ubuntu/Debian specific command, which simply doesn't work on any other distribution. dpkg-stat-override can't possibly work on Fedora. Currently I need to manually put the machine to sleep. Also, /proc/acpi/sleep is deprecated in recent kernels. Please find a way to use KLaptop for SuspendToRAM
* Trinity misses a working NetworkManager applet. I currently use nm-applet, but I can't make it reside in my system tray.
Having said all that, I am really relieved to finally have an up to date distribution with my beloved KDE3 and I'd again like to thank you all for the great work!
Hello, Thanks for reporting the issues. I am the Redhat/Fedora packager. I haven't announced (yet) the availability of the Fedora LiveCD, precisely because there are broken things that I want to solve. Also, since Fedora 16 is out, I will delete the Fedora 15 LiveCD which is now useless.
My answers are below.
Le 11/11/2011 15:53, Peter Lemken a écrit :
- Both CDs cannot launch the live installer from the desktop. It is therefore
necessary to open a terminal, allow root to use the X-server by xhost + and start /usr/bin/liveinst manually.
I've already sorted out the problem. It will be solved in the next F16 ISO.
- The setup cannot be completed, because the default runlevel is 3. One needs to
log in as root and start init 5 to get to the window manager.
This one is already solved too .
- TDE does not recognize one's old settings from a previous installation of
KDE3. I have linked .kde3 to .kde in hy /home and I wonder whee those settings used to resid, or has TDE wiped my .kde? Not good.
As a personal choice, I have hardcoded "~/.trinity" as settings directory for TDE. It is set in /opt/trinity/bin/startkde . So if you have directories ~/.kde and ~/.kde3, they will stay in place without being modified.
- The F15 CD cannot even log into the display manager at all. It is missing a
critical package: for PAM, some gnome package.
- The F15 CD misses the critical step of adding a regular user. I needed to
manually adduser.
Yes, I found these 2 too. It will work in the next F16 LiveCD.
- I can't get compiz to work at all, no matter what window decorator I use,
neither gtk nor KDE4 works. I wish you would add the older compiz 8.6 to trinity, together with kde3-window-decorator.
Some times ago I looked into using Compiz with TDE, but recent Compiz packages are missing the "kde3" window decorator, which is obsolete. I managed to recompile it, but it did not work at all. I gave up since it was not my priority. (I do not use compiz)
- Laptop management is totally broken. The ACPI-helper setup uses an
Ubuntu/Debian specific command, which simply doesn't work on any other distribution. dpkg-stat-override can't possibly work on Fedora. Currently I need to manually put the machine to sleep. Also, /proc/acpi/sleep is deprecated in recent kernels. Please find a way to use KLaptop for SuspendToRAM
Nice catch. I will have a look but I'm not a developer and I have no idea why it needs to use a Debian command.
- Trinity misses a working NetworkManager applet. I currently use nm-applet, but
I can't make it reside in my system tray.
I believe this (having a network manager applet for TDE) was discussed before on the mailing list, but I do not remember the conclusion. You can parse the archives to get some answers.
Having said all that, I am really relieved to finally have an up to date distribution with my beloved KDE3 and I'd again like to thank you all for the great work!
Thanks for your reports - they will help making TDE better
Francois Andriot
Francois Andriot <francois.andriot@...> writes:
[...]
As a personal choice, I have hardcoded "~/.trinity" as settings directory for TDE. It is set in /opt/trinity/bin/startkde . So if you have directories ~/.kde and ~/.kde3, they will stay in place without being modified.
Very good. This leaves me the option of fiddling around with various distributions, although I must say that F16 seems to be a very good distro for my aged T60p.
[...]
- I can't get compiz to work at all, no matter what window decorator I use,
neither gtk nor KDE4 works. I wish you would add the older compiz 8.6 to trinity, together with kde3-window-decorator.
Some times ago I looked into using Compiz with TDE, but recent Compiz packages are missing the "kde3" window decorator, which is obsolete. I managed to recompile it, but it did not work at all. I gave up since it was not my priority. (I do not use compiz)
This s actually kind of a showstopper for me. I will try to work around it by compiling the older version by myself. As I understand 0.9* is a cpomplete rewrite of the code, so we will probably not have a modern compiz working with older KDE. I really want to use compiz as my window manager; Zoom is a requirement for a high resolution (1600x1200) display, so I am keen to learn whether and how someone has been able to use compiz with the latest trinity release.
I shall report.
[KLaptop]
Nice catch. I will have a look but I'm not a developer and I have no idea why it needs to use a Debian command.
I suspect this is due to Trinity's history as an Ubuntu add-on. Now that we have packages for other distributions, this really should be sorted pout. Let me know how I can help in this regard.
[...]
I believe this (having a network manager applet for TDE) was discussed before on the mailing list, but I do not remember the conclusion. You can parse the archives to get some answers.
Will do.
I need to add the following bug:
echo $PATH /opt/kde3/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/X11R6/bin/:/usr/games: /usr/lib/qt4/bin: /usr/bin:/opt/kde3/bin:/home/peter/bin:/home/peter/.local/bin: /home/peter/.local/bin
The path for trinity is /opt/trinity and I needed to set symbolic links to make it work as expected.
Hello, I've just uploaded a Fedora16 LiveCD for i386 which fixes the following issues: - Fedora Live Installer starts correctly (no need for xhost + or anything) - After installation, graphical interface "first boot assistant" runs normally, then come KDM and TDE. - YUM repository for TDE/Fedora is automatically added so that you can install supplementary TDE packages after installation. - PAM configuration is correct so that you can login in KDM.
Also, it contains some non-LiveCD-specific fixes: - dpkg commands in klaptopdaemon were replaced with chown/chmod (this is how it worked in KDE 3.5.10) - Language selection now works correctly (previously we were stuck with english language)
Check out the mirrors, the new ISO is: TDELive-3.5.13-FC16.i386.iso Size: 715128832 bytes (683 MB)
If you see other ISO(s), it means that you have to wait until your TDE mirror is synchronized. I deleted all previous ISO so there should be only this one.
Francois Andriot
On 12 November 2011 08:25, Francois Andriot francois.andriot@free.frwrote:
Hello, I've just uploaded a Fedora16 LiveCD for i386 which fixes the following issues:
- Fedora Live Installer starts correctly (no need for xhost + or anything)
- After installation, graphical interface "first boot assistant" runs
normally, then come KDM and TDE.
- YUM repository for TDE/Fedora is automatically added so that you can
install supplementary TDE packages after installation.
- PAM configuration is correct so that you can login in KDM.
Also, it contains some non-LiveCD-specific fixes:
- dpkg commands in klaptopdaemon were replaced with chown/chmod (this is
how it worked in KDE 3.5.10)
- Language selection now works correctly (previously we were stuck with
english language)
Check out the mirrors, the new ISO is: TDELive-3.5.13-FC16.i386.iso Size: 715128832 bytes (683 MB)
If you see other ISO(s), it means that you have to wait until your TDE mirror is synchronized. I deleted all previous ISO so there should be only this one.
Francois Andriot
Hey can you detail how you did this? I'm on arch and I'd like to be able to use klaptopdaemon as well (is kpowersave also affected?)
Could you generate a patch or some sort?
Le 12/11/2011 16:12, Calvin Morrison a écrit :
Hey can you detail how you did this? I'm on arch and I'd like to be able to use klaptopdaemon as well (is kpowersave also affected?)
Could you generate a patch or some sort?
Hello, there is the patch I use for klaptopdaemon. I do not know if kpowersave is affected.
Francois Andriot
Francois Andriot <francois.andriot@...> writes:
Also, it contains some non-LiveCD-specific fixes:
- dpkg commands in klaptopdaemon were replaced with chown/chmod (this is
how it worked in KDE 3.5.10)
Thank you for the updates. However, Suspend/Resume still cannot work with newer distributions. The kernel interface for that has changed and on F16 /proc/acpi/sleep does not exist anymore, it is deprecated.
I can use pm-suspend on the command line, but I'd rather have that as part of the GUI and also upon closing the lid, which currently doesn't work.
Peter
Le 17/11/2011 14:46, Peter Lemken a écrit :
how it worked in KDE 3.5.10) Thank you for the updates. However, Suspend/Resume still cannot work with newer distributions. The kernel interface for that has changed and on F16 /proc/acpi/sleep does not exist anymore, it is deprecated.
I can use pm-suspend on the command line, but I'd rather have that as part of the GUI and also upon closing the lid, which currently doesn't work.
Hello, from what I see in the klaptopdaemon source code, if /proc/acpi/sleep does not exist, it tries to access /sys/power/state . So the problem must be elsewhere. I've just noticed a bug in TDE RPM packaging: look in /opt/trinity:bin , there are some applications that are symbolic links to "consolehelper". Alas, it is a dead link since "consolehelper" is installed under "/usr/bin", not in current directory . I wil fix i t ASAP.
In the mean time, you can manually fix the problem. Run the commands, as root user: cd /opt/trinity/bin rm -f klaptop_acpi_helper ln -s /usr/bin/consolehelper klaptop_acpi_helper
Please, tell me if that fixes your issue, then I will update the RPM packages.
Francois Andriot
On Friday 11 November 2011 18:53:26 Peter Lemken wrote:
first of all thank you all for keeping KDE3 alive and kicking and for providing packages for the various distributions.
I finally got too fed up with Mandriva and was looking for a better alternative. OpenSuSE 12.1 is really great, but, alas, there are no trinity packages available, yet.
There are KDE3 packages in openSUSE 12.1. What Trinity features do you need that are not included in openSUSE's KDE3?
- Trinity misses a working NetworkManager applet. I currently use nm-applet, but
I can't make it reside in my system tray.
In openSUSE 11.4 knetworkmanager works well. Did not test it under 12.1 though.
Having said all that, I am really relieved to finally have an up to date distribution with my beloved KDE3 and I'd again like to thank you all for the great work!
Ilya Chernykh <anixxsus@...> writes:
On Friday 11 November 2011 18:53:26 Peter Lemken wrote:
There are KDE3 packages in openSUSE 12.1. What Trinity features do you need that are not included in openSUSE's KDE3?
A functional NetworkManager would be great for a start.
In openSUSE 11.4 knetworkmanager works well. Did not test it under 12.1 though.
In OpenSuSE 12.1 and KDE3 NetworkManager does not work at all.
http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=521
KDE:KDE3 repository is not broken and not obsolete.
Wrong. If KDE4's NetworkManager works fine and it does not work in KDE3 from KDE:KDE3 repository, then this repository is clearly broken. You allude to be able to fix it, so this would be greatly appreciated.
At this moment, KDE:KDE3 repository is broken and unusable.
On Thursday 17 November 2011 15:36:36 Peter Lemken wrote:
Ilya Chernykh <anixxsus@...> writes:
On Friday 11 November 2011 18:53:26 Peter Lemken wrote:
There are KDE3 packages in openSUSE 12.1. What Trinity features do you need that are not included in openSUSE's KDE3?
A functional NetworkManager would be great for a start.
In openSUSE 11.4 knetworkmanager works well. Did not test it under 12.1 though.
In OpenSuSE 12.1 and KDE3 NetworkManager does not work at all.
http://bugs.pearsoncomputing.net/show_bug.cgi?id=521
KDE:KDE3 repository is not broken and not obsolete.
Wrong. If KDE4's NetworkManager works fine and it does not work in KDE3 from KDE:KDE3 repository, then this repository is clearly broken. You allude to be able to fix it, so this would be greatly appreciated.
At this moment, KDE:KDE3 repository is broken and unusable.
I would not believe what Pearson claims about KDE:KDE3. He never tried it.
Actually I do not know whether knetworkmanager works under 12.1.
Ilya Chernykh <anixxsus@...> writes:
At this moment, KDE:KDE3 repository is broken and unusable.
I would not believe what Pearson claims about KDE:KDE3. He never tried it.
It's my claim that it is broken and unusable. I have it installed and the repo if listed for use with the official 12.1 release.
Actually I do not know whether knetworkmanager works under 12.1.
I do. It doesn't.
On Friday 18 November 2011 15:33:27 Peter Lemken wrote:
At this moment, KDE:KDE3 repository is broken and unusable.
I would not believe what Pearson claims about KDE:KDE3. He never tried it.
It's my claim that it is broken and unusable. I have it installed and the repo if listed for use with the official 12.1 release.
Which packages exactly are broken or unusable?
Actually I do not know whether knetworkmanager works under 12.1.
I do. It doesn't.
OK. But problems in knetworkmanager do not give right to claim that KDE:KDE3 is broken as a whole. In Trinity knetworkmanager does not work either with NM 0.9.
Ilya Chernykh <anixxsus@...> writes:
OK. But problems in knetworkmanager do not give right to claim that KDE:KDE3 is broken as a whole. In Trinity knetworkmanager does not work either with NM 0.9.
On Saturday 19 November 2011 12:19:06 Peter Lemken wrote:
OK. But problems in knetworkmanager do not give right to claim that KDE:KDE3 is broken as a whole. In Trinity knetworkmanager does not work either with NM 0.9.
So?
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Calvin Morrison -
Francois Andriot -
François ANDRIOT
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Ilya Chernykh -
Peter Lemken