Greetings, everybody, and happy 2025 even though the start to the year does not seem promising in many places.
Digging through issues one by one here. Am using the desktop more after having gotten a TKL (SSK in IBM parlance) Model M from Unicomp. I have a couple of genuine IBM SSKs, but they have become to valuable to use. The Unicomp reissue is if anything better, and I love it. But I digress.
I'm running Debian Trixie and TDE-almost-ready (I don't remember what TDE testing is called, but I'm running the not-bleeding-edge testing version, the middle one).
I've discovered that sound doesn't work on my machine. I imagine that this comes down to Pipewire, the Wayland of sound. (No, I do not use Wayland. Playing pioneer in Linux was a hoot 25 years ago; now I just want the damn machine to work.) When setting up a couple of Rspberry Pi5s as television sets last year, I got no sound until I nuked Pipewire entirely, which I haven't done here on the desktop yet.
KMix seems in order. I have gone everywhere I could find to set the audio to the built-in audio -- the system seems desperate to give me HDMI audio, but I have no HDMI audio. At the moment, I have no audio of any sort, but at least I have the hardware for non-HDMI audio.
pulseaudio -v renders this:
I: [pulseaudio] main.c: setrlimit(RLIMIT_NICE, (31, 31)) failed: Operation not permitted I: [pulseaudio] main.c: setrlimit(RLIMIT_RTPRIO, (9, 9)) failed: Operation not permitted I: [pulseaudio] core-util.c: Successfully gained nice level -11. I: [pulseaudio] main.c: This is PulseAudio 17.0 I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Page size is 4096 bytes I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Machine ID is 5319a42264b14252b3e0bc50dadf9032. I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Session ID is 4. I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Using runtime directory /run/user/1000/pulse. I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Using state directory /home/dep/.pulse. I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Using modules directory /usr/lib/pulse-17.0+dfsg1/modules. I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Running in system mode: no E: [pulseaudio] pid.c: Daemon already running. E: [pulseaudio] main.c: pa_pid_file_create() failed.
When I check the sound system page in KControl, all seems fine. System restarts uneventfully. Everything seems to work except sound coming from the speakers.
I'm out of guesses. Advice?
said dep via tde-users: | Greetings, everybody, and happy 2025 even though the start to the year | does not seem promising in many places. | | Digging through issues one by one here. Am using the desktop more after | having gotten a TKL (SSK in IBM parlance) Model M from Unicomp. I have a | couple of genuine IBM SSKs, but they have become to valuable to use. The | Unicomp reissue is if anything better, and I love it. But I digress. | | I'm running Debian Trixie and TDE-almost-ready (I don't remember what | TDE testing is called, but I'm running the not-bleeding-edge testing | version, the middle one). | | I've discovered that sound doesn't work on my machine. I imagine that | this comes down to Pipewire, the Wayland of sound. (No, I do not use | Wayland. Playing pioneer in Linux was a hoot 25 years ago; now I just | want the damn machine to work.) When setting up a couple of Rspberry | Pi5s as television sets last year, I got no sound until I nuked Pipewire | entirely, which I haven't done here on the desktop yet. | | KMix seems in order. I have gone everywhere I could find to set the | audio to the built-in audio -- the system seems desperate to give me | HDMI audio, but I have no HDMI audio. At the moment, I have no audio of | any sort, but at least I have the hardware for non-HDMI audio. | | pulseaudio -v renders this: | | I: [pulseaudio] main.c: setrlimit(RLIMIT_NICE, (31, 31)) failed: | Operation not permitted | I: [pulseaudio] main.c: setrlimit(RLIMIT_RTPRIO, (9, 9)) failed: | Operation not permitted | I: [pulseaudio] core-util.c: Successfully gained nice level -11. | I: [pulseaudio] main.c: This is PulseAudio 17.0 | I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Page size is 4096 bytes | I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Machine ID is 5319a42264b14252b3e0bc50dadf9032. | I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Session ID is 4. | I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Using runtime directory /run/user/1000/pulse. | I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Using state directory /home/dep/.pulse. | I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Using modules | directory /usr/lib/pulse-17.0+dfsg1/modules. | I: [pulseaudio] main.c: Running in system mode: no | E: [pulseaudio] pid.c: Daemon already running. | E: [pulseaudio] main.c: pa_pid_file_create() failed. | | When I check the sound system page in KControl, all seems fine. System | restarts uneventfully. Everything seems to work except sound coming from | the speakers. | | I'm out of guesses. Advice? | -- | dep
Trying various settings in pavucontrol I found a place where it was seemingly forcing HDMI. I disabled that, apparently, because instantly I had sound. Oh, and nuked pipewire and all its near relatives and close friends.
dep via tde-users wrote:
Trying various settings in pavucontrol I found a place where it was seemingly forcing HDMI. I disabled that, apparently, because instantly I had sound. Oh, and nuked pipewire and all its near relatives and close friends.
if hdmi is initialized as first device and is picked up by pulse you must change the index value in the modules. Here it looks like this
/etc/modprobe.d/alsa-base.conf options snd_hda_intel index=0 options snd-usb-audio index=1
This makes sure that the built in is always the first card.
Regarding pipewire, you can remove this package as it is not used by TDE.
On 1/9/25 11:07 AM, dep via tde-users wrote:
Trying various settings in pavucontrol I found a place where it was seemingly forcing HDMI. I disabled that, apparently, because instantly I had sound. Oh, and nuked pipewire and all its near relatives and close friends.
Just a slight aside. While I very much embrace your 25 year model and bleeding edge, I have had a very different experience with pipewire. Arch moved to pipewire several years ago, and I was skeptical of the new sound approach. However, my experience with it since on Arch and openSUSE (Tumbleweed) and PiOS has been painless and quite pleasant. Whether it is normal sound, or streaming audio with mplayer from the command-line over a remote connected machine to speakers -- it has simply worked.
The unpleasant part (and this is true for pulseaudio, generally), the sound setup is enabled as a user-service (at least by systemd). This means that the sound system isn't enable completely at boot, but relies on user-login and systemd magic to make all the source/sink connections. While I can appreciate the design from a multi-user standpoint, it is a PITA if you just want to use a box as a sound server without a user having to login.
So "don't throw the baby out with the bathwater." There may be OS difficulties in arriving at that "perfect user-service systemd setup voodoo", but when it works, it works quite well.
Glad you got your sound working, and pulseaudio alone will work quite well too. However, with a slight view of what the future holds, it may be worth making friends with pipewire too :)
Anno domini 2025 Thu, 09 Jan 16:58:03 +0000 dep via tde-users scripsit:
Greetings, everybody, and happy 2025 even though the start to the year does not seem promising in many places.
Digging through issues one by one here. Am using the desktop more after having gotten a TKL (SSK in IBM parlance) Model M from Unicomp. I have a couple of genuine IBM SSKs, but they have become to valuable to use. The Unicomp reissue is if anything better, and I love it. But I digress.
Oh ... I want one ... just for decoration that is :)
I've discovered that sound doesn't work on my machine. I imagine that this
[...]
When I check the sound system page in KControl, all seems fine. System restarts uneventfully. Everything seems to work except sound coming from the speakers.
I'm out of guesses. Advice?
Try "alsamixer" or "amixer". Im my .xsessionrc I have:
amixer sset PCM 100% amixer sset Master 55% on amixer sset Speaker 0% off amixer sset Headphone 100% on amixer sset Headphone,0 on amixer sset Headphone,1 on
... note the handling of "Headphone". And I nuked pulseaudio and bluetooth.
Nik
-- Please do not email me anything that you are not comfortable also sharing with the NSA, CIA ...
said Dr. Nikolaus Klepp via tde-users:
| > Digging through issues one by one here. Am using the desktop more | > after having gotten a TKL (SSK in IBM parlance) Model M from Unicomp. | > I have a couple of genuine IBM SSKs, but they have become to valuable | > to use. The Unicomp reissue is if anything better, and I love it. But | > I digress. | | Oh ... I want one ... just for decoration that is :)
It's here: https://www.pckeyboard.com/page/product/MINI_M
The white keys are definitely better in person than the gray ones. Unicomp was Lexmark employees who bought up all the equipment when Lexmark stopped making Model M keyboards for IBM (and the equipment used by IBM before it spun off keyboards and printers as Lexmark). They kept making Model Ms, though after the existing stock was gone sold them as Unicomp. I have a batch of them from those days (and earlier, actually -- more Model Ms than anyone has a right to, including the 122-key battle cruisers in both IBM and Unicomp livery). Anyway, over the years the equipment got worn out and the quality suffered, so a few uears ago Unicomp created the New Model M (https://www.pckeyboard.com/page/product/NEW_M), which had the same guts but a less ridiculous case, all new tooling, and as a result a brand new Model M, unavailable since IBM made 'em pre-1991.
Then, by popular demand, they produced the Mini M, which is like the IBM Space Saving keyboard -- a model M without the number pad. Much nicer, actually, than my original SSKs. All nice and clicky and good. (They still make the older stuff for those who prefer it. Fortunately, the Unicomp Model Ms I have are nearly 20 years old, so they were made before the tooling went loose.) The Mini M I'm typing this on was made December 10 and I received it December 18. Like IBM, they put the "birth certificate" on the back. Praise the Lord, there is no awful Unicomp logo on the front of the keyboard. Though the LEDs are a too-bright blue, if you get some very yellow gel or tape, you can turn 'em green the way God intended.
Chyrosran22, the Jeff Cooper of keyboards, did an excellent review: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxT1ja8OWRY
While we're in the neighborhood, a guy named Joe is also reproducing the Model F, which is in some respects clickier and nicer and more technically profound. Those who have gotten them seem to love them, though they come without the keys attached and the whole operation seems slightly, um, weird to me. I asked a few questions, swallowed hard and ordered one anyway, but Joe canceled my order because I'm not the kind of customer he wants. (He's right.) In case you're more forgiving than I am and are interested: https://www.modelfkeyboards.com/
Chyrosran22 on the Brand New Model F, to which project I believe he contributed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yzcEtwSFz9I
And to round it off, there is an application, "bucklespring," that plays the sounds of a Model M through your speakers as you type. I installed and used it just to see how it sounds, then deleted it, inasmuch as I have an actual Model M.
I wrote about some of this here: https://ofb.biz/sa1250
And here: https://ofb.biz/safari/article/1272.html
On Thu, 09 Jan 2025 17:57:53 +0000 dep via tde-users users@trinitydesktop.org wrote:
said Dr. Nikolaus Klepp via tde-users:
| > Digging through issues one by one here. Am using the desktop more | > after having gotten a TKL (SSK in IBM parlance) Model M from Unicomp. | > I have a couple of genuine IBM SSKs, but they have become to valuable | > to use. The Unicomp reissue is if anything better, and I love it. But | > I digress. | | Oh ... I want one ... just for decoration that is :)
It's here: https://www.pckeyboard.com/page/product/MINI_M
The white keys are definitely better in person than the gray ones. Unicomp was Lexmark employees who bought up all the equipment when Lexmark stopped making Model M keyboards for IBM (and the equipment used by IBM before it spun off keyboards and printers as Lexmark). They kept making Model Ms, though after the existing stock was gone sold them as Unicomp. I have a batch of them from those days (and earlier, actually -- more Model Ms than anyone has a right to, including the 122-key battle cruisers in both IBM and Unicomp livery). Anyway, over the years the equipment got worn out and the quality suffered, so a few uears ago Unicomp created the New Model M (https://www.pckeyboard.com/page/product/NEW_M), which had the same guts but a less ridiculous case, all new tooling, and as a result a brand new Model M, unavailable since IBM made 'em pre-1991.
I have the 103-key New Model M. They're good keyboards, nice and solid, with crisp, clicky keys thanks to the buckling spring mechanism.
The other nice thing about Unicomp is that they will service their keyboards (and, I believe, any old IBM-made Model Ms you may have laying around). I had to send mine in after an unfortunate encounter with a mug of hot chocolate. Shipping wasn't cheap, but I got a functional keyboard back.
I've been eyeing the Model F replicas for a while, but I can't justify buying a keyboard that would cost more than the laptop I just picked up off eBay.
E. Liddell
dep via tde-users wrote:
pulseaudio -v renders this:
this assumes that pulseaudio was stopped before this, but you can not stop it, because it restarts automatically. To add debuggin you need to change the config.
Use $ pactl list to see what plugins you have configured.
Although you can see this in kmix as well
Time ago it was necessary to just unmute the channels.
If you want to debug lower level, check amixer
$ amixer Simple mixer control 'Master',0 Capabilities: pvolume pswitch pswitch-joined Playback channels: Front Left - Front Right Limits: Playback 0 - 65536 Mono: Front Left: Playback 19660 [30%] [on] Front Right: Playback 19660 [30%] [on] Simple mixer control 'Capture',0 Capabilities: cvolume cvolume-joined cswitch cswitch-joined Capture channels: Mono Limits: Capture 0 - 65536 Mono: Capture 65536 [100%] [on]
or
# dmesg | grep sound [ 11.462602] input: HDA Digital PCBeep as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:1b.0/sound/card0/input9 [ 11.462657] input: HDA Intel PCH Mic as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:1b.0/sound/card0/input10 [ 11.463067] input: HDA Intel PCH Line as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:1b.0/sound/card0/input11 [ 11.463122] input: HDA Intel PCH Line Out as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:1b.0/sound/card0/input12 [ 11.463200] input: HDA Intel PCH Front Headphone as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:1b.0/sound/card0/input13 [ 11.463262] input: HDA Intel PCH HDMI/DP,pcm=3 as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:1b.0/sound/card0/input14 [ 11.463338] input: HDA Intel PCH HDMI/DP,pcm=7 as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:1b.0/sound/card0/input15 [ 11.463409] input: HDA Intel PCH HDMI/DP,pcm=8 as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:1b.0/sound/card0/input16
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David C. Rankin -
deloptes -
dep -
Dr. Nikolaus Klepp -
E. Liddell