So, I decided to try Debian 10. The install was uneventful.
Fun started when I wanted to "remove" systemd, using the recipe given here before: install install sysv-rc and sysvinit-core. It worked but... it removed network-manager and lightdm (and others I did not have time to write down). AT the next reboot there is a looooong wait at: starting system message : dbus, then all I get is a command line login. I log and there is another delay before getting a prompt. Network in unreachable and I can hardly install without it :((
I had installed with xfce, I can try with some other DE. Or install TDE and hope removing systemd won't wreck everything beyond repair...
Anyone got Buster running without systemd? Otherwise I'll wait for Devuan to release its Buster equivalent.
Thierry
Anno domini 2019 Sun, 14 Jul 22:49:48 +0200 Thierry de Coulon scripsit:
So, I decided to try Debian 10. The install was uneventful.
Fun started when I wanted to "remove" systemd, using the recipe given here before: install install sysv-rc and sysvinit-core. It worked but... it removed network-manager and lightdm (and others I did not have time to write down). AT the next reboot there is a looooong wait at: starting system message : dbus, then all I get is a command line login. I log and there is another delay before getting a prompt. Network in unreachable and I can hardly install without it :((
I had installed with xfce, I can try with some other DE. Or install TDE and hope removing systemd won't wreck everything beyond repair...
Anyone got Buster running without systemd? Otherwise I'll wait for Devuan to release its Buster equivalent.
Some folks on the devuan mailinglist tried it, what I have read it looks like it should be doable. On the other hand, there is that big red warning on low entropy systems ...
Nik
Thierry
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On Sun July 14 2019 13:49:48 Thierry de Coulon wrote:
Anyone got Buster running without systemd? Otherwise I'll wait for Devuan to release its Buster equivalent.
Other than an obscure problem with non-xinerama multi screen configurations, Buster and 14.0.7 work fine here, upgraded from Stretch, in various laptops, servers, and VPSs. Here are the relevant packages on my laptop:
# dpkg -l '*sysv*' | grep '^ii' ii sysv-rc 2.93-8 all System-V-like runlevel change mechanism ii sysvinit-core 2.93-8 amd64 System-V-like init utilities ii sysvinit-utils 2.93-8 amd64 System-V-like utilities # dpkg -l '*systemd*' | grep '^ii' ii libsystemd0:amd64 241-5 amd64 systemd utility library ii libsystemd0:i386 241-5 i386 systemd utility library
If you're not multiarch you won't need libsystem0:i386.
--Mike
On Sun July 14 2019 15:41:29 Mike Bird wrote:
On Sun July 14 2019 13:49:48 Thierry de Coulon wrote:
Anyone got Buster running without systemd? Otherwise I'll wait for Devuan to release its Buster equivalent.
Also check that you don't have any partially installed packages. This should produce no output:
dpkg -l | tail +6 | grep -v '^ii'
--Mike
On 14/07/2019 22:49, Thierry de Coulon wrote:
So, I decided to try Debian 10. The install was uneventful.
Fun started when I wanted to "remove" systemd, using the recipe given here before: install install sysv-rc and sysvinit-core. It worked but... it removed network-manager and lightdm (and others I did not have time to write down). AT the next reboot there is a looooong wait at: starting system message : dbus, then all I get is a command line login. I log and there is another delay before getting a prompt. Network in unreachable and I can hardly install without it :((
I had installed with xfce, I can try with some other DE. Or install TDE and hope removing systemd won't wreck everything beyond repair...
Anyone got Buster running without systemd? Otherwise I'll wait for Devuan to release its Buster equivalent.
For those Systemd agnostics' (but still Deb focused), there's also Antix (https://antixlinux.com/antix-19-b2-full-64-and-32-bit-available/) as alternatives.
Their last beta is running fine here (didn't give their installer a try though!).
Cheers!
On Monday 15 July 2019 06.00:13 gregory guy wrote:
For those Systemd agnostics' (but still Deb focused), there's also Antix (https://antixlinux.com/antix-19-b2-full-64-and-32-bit-available/) as alternatives.
Last time I tried it there were problems (don't remerber what, but somerthing did not work as expected). WOrth a second try probably :)
Thierry
On 15/07/2019 08:30, Thierry de Coulon wrote:
On Monday 15 July 2019 06.00:13 gregory guy wrote:
For those Systemd agnostics' (but still Deb focused), there's also Antix (https://antixlinux.com/antix-19-b2-full-64-and-32-bit-available/) as alternatives.
Last time I tried it there were problems (don't remerber what, but somerthing did not work as expected). WOrth a second try probably :)
Thierry
I tried their last stable iso, even if the system "seemed" to have been installed properly, the boot loader did not --> Didn't push further.
Feel free to report us if you're sailing a smooth sea with this one ;-)
@+
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Just my two cents... I have used systemd in debian since the time it became the default. Never had major issues, except for having to reduce the timeout from 90s to 5s to avoid to occasional long wait at the beginning or shutdown. I don't bother about the "with vs. without systemd" feud on the internet, as long as the system works :-)
Cheers Michele
On Monday 15 July 2019 09.55:55 Michele Calgaro via trinity-users wrote:
Just my two cents... I have used systemd in debian since the time it became the default. Never had major issues, except for having to reduce the timeout from 90s to 5s to avoid to occasional long wait at the beginning or shutdown. I don't bother about the "with vs. without systemd" feud on the internet, as long as the system works :-)
Cheers Michele
5s works? When looking for this I found "You don't want to set these too low. Otherwise, systemd may not have enough time to safely start amd stop units"
Thierry
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On 2019/07/15 05:34 PM, Thierry de Coulon wrote:
5s works? When looking for this I found "You don't want to set these too low. Otherwise, systemd may not have enough time to safely start amd stop units"
Thierry
Works like a charm, at least here: :-) Probably you can also make it smaller if you wish. Cheers Michele
Anno domini 2019 Mon, 15 Jul 15:55:55 +0800 Michele Calgaro via trinity-users scripsit:
Just my two cents... I have used systemd in debian since the time it became the default. Never had major issues, except for having to reduce the timeout from 90s to 5s to avoid to occasional long wait at the beginning or shutdown. I don't bother about the "with vs. without systemd" feud on the internet, as long as the system works :-)
Cheers Michele
Hi Michele!
You might want to check the random number sequence after bootup on your debian system.
Nik
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On 2019/07/15 06:38 PM, Dr. Nikolaus Klepp wrote:
Hi Michele!
You might want to check the random number sequence after bootup on your debian system.
Nik
Hi Nik, not sure I understand what you mean...
Cheers Michele
Anno domini 2019 Tue, 16 Jul 09:07:06 +0800 Michele Calgaro via trinity-users scripsit:
On 2019/07/15 06:38 PM, Dr. Nikolaus Klepp wrote:
Hi Michele!
You might want to check the random number sequence after bootup on your debian system.
Nik
Hi Nik, not sure I understand what you mean...
Your random number generator will most likely emit 0xffffffffffffffff after depletion. It was discussed lenthly here: https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20190708.153519.4bc23e3e.en.html
Basicly things start to get strange here: https://www.debian.org/releases/buster/amd64/release-notes/ch-information.en...
Probably all people running servers on debian buster have seen this happen (it's not new, things just got worse since stretch): https://daniel-lange.com/archives/152-hello-buster.html
Nik
Cheers Michele
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On 2019/07/16 03:29 PM, Dr. Nikolaus Klepp wrote:
Anno domini 2019 Tue, 16 Jul 09:07:06 +0800 Michele Calgaro via trinity-users scripsit:
On 2019/07/15 06:38 PM, Dr. Nikolaus Klepp wrote:
Hi Michele!
You might want to check the random number sequence after bootup on your debian system.
Nik
Hi Nik, not sure I understand what you mean...
Your random number generator will most likely emit 0xffffffffffffffff after depletion. It was discussed lenthly here: https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20190708.153519.4bc23e3e.en.html
Basicly things start to get strange here: https://www.debian.org/releases/buster/amd64/release-notes/ch-information.en...
Probably all people running servers on debian buster have seen this happen (it's not new, things just got worse since stretch): https://daniel-lange.com/archives/152-hello-buster.html
Thanks Nik, interesting reading. Anyhow for my system and my usage, I have seen no issues for long long time. Maybe I have just been lucky :-)
Cheers Michele
-
Dr. Nikolaus Klepp -
gregory guy -
Michele Calgaro via trinity-users -
Mike Bird -
Thierry de Coulon