On 4/10/25 12:12 PM, William Morder via tde-users wrote:

You want Devuan, the non-systemd fork of Debian. I myself, Nik, and a few others on the list, are Devuan users.

Thank you for the information and helpful links. :)

I probably also should have a TDE live ISO. I see a few options in the wiki.

I sometimes wonder if the issues I report are in the way TDE is compiled in Slackware. Or the way Slackware is built. Something just isn't right here. I report too many issues. I seem to be paper cutting myself to death. I get discouraged nobody else seems to find these issues. I feel like some kind of proverbial annoying squeaky wheel. Conversely, perhaps I use TDE in a manner outside the normal user bell curve and I get to be the lucky one to hit all the speed bumps.

A live TDE ISO would allow me a quick way to test something in a different distro on the same real hardware. Just something that boots to TDE to test issues -- proof of concept approach.

Thanks for the reply.

On 4/11/25 12:11 PM, William Morder via tde-users wrote:

Yeah, you know ... I tried Slackware, way back when, and if I were not running Devuan or another Debian-type OS, then I would probably move on to Slackware, which seems more in the direction I would move ... except, Slackware is just a little too much bother for me.

I don't work in the field. I use my machines to do other things in life. When I can live somewhere that I have the space, then I would probably have, once again, a room dedicated just to my machines, where I could have a test board, and various boxes in different stages of building or disrepair, because I do like to tinker with them, and I like building Frankensteins out of found junk. But not at the moment; I have other, more pressing needs.

Also, in my own opinion, the Trinity ISOs leave much to be desired. I tried installing from some of them, 'Buntus and I think some others. (I have most of my stuff packed away in storage.) Like I said, once I landed on Debian, that was good, but I didn't like the changes to systemd, and the internal chaos and controversies among the devs. Maybe Devuan is just as bad, and I just haven't heard about it yet? And maybe Devuan will go the same way as Debian, then I'll have to find yet another OS. But for now, I am content with Devuan.

If you somehow manage to get TDE working with Slackware, I would definitely be interested in that, and will keep following your posts. If you create a disc, live or installation images, I will also gladly give them a test drive. Nik created some discs with TDE and Devuan bundled together, but he uses a flavor of Devuan that is unfamiliar to me, and I never could get it working right. There might be a few others out there.

If you are already comfortable running Slackware, then I would say that Devuan will be like a walk in the park for you.

Thanks for chatting out loud with me. :)

Not that I can't change, but I've been on Slackware for 25 years or so. At one time I supported Debian systems as an admin, but the move to systemd left me cold. There are certain things I like to do with my computers and systemd does not let me do them. I could be naive and ignorant about those systemd blockers, but Slackware stays out of my way and I do what I want. If there is one thing I want in an operating system is to stay out of my way.

I could adapt to Devuan or some other non systemd distro that is well supported by TDE. But I'm an old guy. While old dogs can learn new tricks, old dogs always ask, "Why should I bother?"

The problem is not that TDE can't compile and run on Slackware. I am doing that fine. The problem is the many paper cut issues I keep running into. I post here and nobody sees the same thing. So is the problem PEBKAC? Slackware? An oversight in compiling the package? Something else?

I can't ignore that TDE development is mostly Debian/Ubuntu oriented and everybody else are outliers. When the TDE project began I was heavily involved and seemed like about every other day I was posting issues with compiling that Debian/Ubuntu users never thought about. We fixed the issues, no complaints about that. Only that without a large involvement of people using other distros everybody outside of Debian/Ubuntu is fighting the proverbial Sisyphean uphill battle.

I'm not trying to sound bitter. I am frustrated, that's all. My aging brain doesn't fire like 15 years ago when TDE began. I do a lot to keep my mind working, but aging slowly wins this deterioration game. Usually I solve problems but the thinking process now takes me three times longer. Or more.

I am not discounting that Slackware is designed differently from what Debian/Ubuntu TDE users expect. That is not really a problem. The challenge is getting answers to help resolve the differences. And most Debian/Ubuntu folks don't know the answers and shrug.

Part of my frustration is finding paper cuts and then discovering I filed bug reports 15 years ago. Discouraging.

I am working on my own build script environment for Slackware. Takes time though. I don't really have interest or the skills to create a live ISO or anything like that. There is one person in the Slackware community who makes robust ISOs, but TDE is not one of the desktop choices. Likely with enough grunting I could massage that image with TDE, but that is far down the road and is something younger whiz kids should tackle.

So I guess I keep plugging away, keep asking questions, and keep filing bug reports and feature requests. Not much else I can do. :)

On Friday 11 April 2025 14:01:10 Darrell Anderson via tde-users wrote:

I could adapt to Devuan or some other non systemd distro that is well supported by TDE. But I'm an old guy. While old dogs can learn new tricks, old dogs always ask, "Why should I bother?"

I am pretty old myself, dude, 67 years as of this past February. There are a few others who are older, but I think I'm probably counted among the elders. And let's not forget Gene, who is still chugging away in his 90s.

But yeah, I dislike changing just for the sake of change. I like the comfort of using the same old things until they wear out; the same with my machines. Novelty for novelty's sake gets old really fast.

I am working on my own build script environment for Slackware. Takes time though. I don't really have interest or the skills to create a live ISO or anything like that. There is one person in the Slackware community who makes robust ISOs, but TDE is not one of the desktop choices. Likely with enough grunting I could massage that image with TDE, but that is far down the road and is something younger whiz kids should tackle.

Again, that sounds like a good option, to use one of those images to get started, put TDE on that. But then, I gave up on Slackware years ago, once I found Devuan, so I don't appreciate the problems involved.

I do have a couple of repair discs that are based on Slackware (Slacko comes to mind), but like yourself, I am already comfortable with where I am, no need to explore further.

So I guess I keep plugging away, keep asking questions, and keep filing bug reports and feature requests. Not much else I can do. :)

Maybe put out a call especially to Slackware users, here on the TDE mailing list, but also search the Slackware forums (I assume that there are such) to find some other TDE users, or at least some people who might be willing to help.

I seem to recall that there were some Slackware users here on the Trinity list, and that there used to be some (probably old) Slackware ISOs with TDE. Maybe they are archived somewhere?

Bill

I can't ignore that TDE development is mostly Debian/Ubuntu oriented and everybody else are outliers.

I understand the frustration and this is not to minimize your efforts to improve TDE on Slackware. I have been using TDE on openSUSE Leap 15.x and it has been working pretty fine. But openSUSE also uses the mainstream stuff like systemd. Who knows how things may change (hopefully not in a negative way) with Leap 16.x. Isn't openSUSE (former SuSE) derived from Slackware?

Gianluca

On Fri, 11 Apr 2025, Darrell Anderson via tde-users wrote:

On 4/11/25 12:11 PM, William Morder via tde-users wrote:

...

Yeah, you know ... I tried Slackware, way back when, and if I were not running Devuan or another Debian-type OS, then I would probably move on to Slackware, which seems more in the direction I would move ... except, Slackware is just a little too much bother for me.

I don't work in the field. I use my machines to do other things in life. When I can live somewhere that I have the space, then I would probably have, once again, a room dedicated just to my machines, where I could have a test board, and various boxes in different stages of building or disrepair, because I do like to tinker with them, and I like building Frankensteins out of found junk. But not at the moment; I have other, more pressing needs.

Also, in my own opinion, the Trinity ISOs leave much to be desired. I tried installing from some of them, 'Buntus and I think some others. (I have most of my stuff packed away in storage.) Like I said, once I landed on Debian, that was good, but I didn't like the changes to systemd, and the internal chaos and controversies among the devs. Maybe Devuan is just as bad, and I just haven't heard about it yet? And maybe Devuan will go the same way as Debian, then I'll have to find yet another OS. But for now, I am content with Devuan.

If you somehow manage to get TDE working with Slackware, I would definitely be interested in that, and will keep following your posts. If you create a disc, live or installation images, I will also gladly give them a test drive. Nik created some discs with TDE and Devuan bundled together, but he uses a flavor of Devuan that is unfamiliar to me, and I never could get it working right. There might be a few others out there.

If you are already comfortable running Slackware, then I would say that Devuan will be like a walk in the park for you.

Thanks for chatting out loud with me. :)

Not that I can't change, but I've been on Slackware for 25 years or so. At one time I supported Debian systems as an admin, but the move to systemd left me cold. There are certain things I like to do with my computers and systemd does not let me do them. I could be naive and ignorant about those systemd blockers, but Slackware stays out of my way and I do what I want. If there is one thing I want in an operating system is to stay out of my way.

I could adapt to Devuan or some other non systemd distro that is well supported by TDE. But I'm an old guy. While old dogs can learn new tricks, old dogs always ask, "Why should I bother?"

The problem is not that TDE can't compile and run on Slackware. I am doing that fine. The problem is the many paper cut issues I keep running into. I post here and nobody sees the same thing. So is the problem PEBKAC? Slackware? An oversight in compiling the package? Something else?

I can't ignore that TDE development is mostly Debian/Ubuntu oriented and everybody else are outliers. When the TDE project began I was heavily involved and seemed like about every other day I was posting issues with compiling that Debian/Ubuntu users never thought about. We fixed the issues, no complaints about that. Only that without a large involvement of people using other distros everybody outside of Debian/Ubuntu is fighting the proverbial Sisyphean uphill battle.

I'm not trying to sound bitter. I am frustrated, that's all. My aging brain doesn't fire like 15 years ago when TDE began. I do a lot to keep my mind working, but aging slowly wins this deterioration game. Usually I solve problems but the thinking process now takes me three times longer. Or more.

I am not discounting that Slackware is designed differently from what Debian/Ubuntu TDE users expect. That is not really a problem. The challenge is getting answers to help resolve the differences. And most Debian/Ubuntu folks don't know the answers and shrug.

Part of my frustration is finding paper cuts and then discovering I filed bug reports 15 years ago. Discouraging.

I am working on my own build script environment for Slackware. Takes time though. I don't really have interest or the skills to create a live ISO or anything like that. There is one person in the Slackware community who makes robust ISOs, but TDE is not one of the desktop choices. Likely with enough grunting I could massage that image with TDE, but that is far down the road and is something younger whiz kids should tackle.

So I guess I keep plugging away, keep asking questions, and keep filing bug reports and feature requests. Not much else I can do. :) ____________________________________________________ tde-users mailing list -- users@trinitydesktop.org To unsubscribe send an email to users-leave@trinitydesktop.org Web mail archive available at https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://mail.trinitydesktop.org/mailman3/hyperki...

----------------------------------------------------- Gianluca Interlandi, PhD gianluca@u.washington.edu +1 (206) 685 4435 http://gianluca.today/research/

Department of Bioengineering University of Washington, Seattle WA U.S.A. -----------------------------------------------------

On 4/11/25 6:04 PM, Gianluca Interlandi via tde-users wrote:

I understand the frustration and this is not to minimize your efforts to improve TDE on Slackware. I have been using TDE on openSUSE Leap 15.x and it has been working pretty fine. But openSUSE also uses the mainstream stuff like systemd. Who knows how things may change (hopefully not in a negative way) with Leap 16.x. Isn't openSUSE (former SuSE) derived from Slackware?

Historically, yes, back in the 1990s. But the design of Suse changed to RPMs soon thereafter. Any relationship these days to Slackware is only an historical footnote.

Slackware uses txz tarballs for packages (originally tgz) and has its own set of package management tools. Slackware design has changed little since inception. Booting the install floppy disks from the early versions look similar to the latest official release.

A common foundation doesn't mean Slackware hasn't evolved and kept pace though.