After upgrading, this has once again shown its ugly head.
On 2018-06-10 21:43:36 Michele Calgaro wrote:
On 2018/06/10 04:40 AM, Nick Koretsky wrote:
Hi!
I am on preliminary stable builds on debian stretch. After the last update i am getting an r14-xdg-update error 9 on login. It complains about permissions and tells to look at r14-xdg-update-validation-test9.txt. There is one line in here <Filename>kde-kchmviewer.desktop</Filename> No such file exist anywhere. What i am supposed to do with this?
In $HOME/.config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu, there should be an entry like "<Filename>kde-kchmviewer", which is triggering that error. Why is there is not possible to say, there has been no change lately to justify such an error. Cheers Michele
I still don't understand what the entries in .config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu relate to, and why they cause this problem. Should I just blindly remove all entries that begin with 'kde-'? (Not the ones that begin with 'tde-kde-', presumably.) Do they have something to do with the .desktop files that appear in ~/Desktop/? This thing is a frustrating nuisance because there's effectively NOTHING beyond a few cryptic entries in Release Notes and the pop-up messages (which can't be copied, and don't seem to be saved anywhere. (Why is that?) if there is any documentation concerning this, I can't find it in the Wiki (beyond "Upgrading from KDE3 or from TDE 3.5.x to R14.0.x" in "Tips and Tricks", which seems to be pertinent but says nothing about recovering from errors), nor in the Documentation section. It seems to me that there needs to be some real documentation about recovering from this situation, written by someone who understands in detail what this stuff is trying to do.
Leslie -- openSUSE Leap 15.2 x86_64 Qt: 3.5.0 TDE: R14.0.9 tde-config: 1.0
Hi Leslie,
Am Mittwoch, 19. Mai 2021 schrieb J Leslie Turriff:
After upgrading, this has once again shown its ugly head.
On 2018-06-10 21:43:36 Michele Calgaro wrote:
On 2018/06/10 04:40 AM, Nick Koretsky wrote:
Hi!
I am on preliminary stable builds on debian stretch. After the last update i am getting an r14-xdg-update error 9 on login. It complains about permissions and tells to look at r14-xdg-update-validation-test9.txt. There is one line in here <Filename>kde-kchmviewer.desktop</Filename> No such file exist anywhere. What i am supposed to do with this?
In $HOME/.config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu, there should be an entry like "<Filename>kde-kchmviewer", which is triggering that error. Why is there is not possible to say, there has been no change lately to justify such an error. Cheers Michele
I still don't understand what the entries in .config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu relate to, and why they cause this problem. Should I just blindly remove all entries that begin with 'kde-'?
Yes.
(Not the ones that begin with 'tde-kde-', presumably.) Do they have something to do with the .desktop files that appear in ~/Desktop/? This thing is a frustrating nuisance because there's effectively NOTHING beyond a few cryptic entries in Release Notes and the pop-up messages (which can't be copied, and don't seem to be saved anywhere. (Why is that?) if there is any documentation concerning this, I can't find it in the Wiki (beyond "Upgrading from KDE3 or from TDE 3.5.x to R14.0.x" in "Tips and Tricks", which seems to be pertinent but says nothing about recovering from errors), nor in the Documentation section. It seems to me that there needs to be some real documentation about recovering from this situation, written by someone who understands in detail what this stuff is trying to do.
You can find the relevant information in the archive of this ML. It's been discussed at least two times already.
A page in the wiki would be nice to have. Someone has to write it.
Kind regards, Stefan
On 2021-05-19 06:58:51 Stefan Krusche via tde-users wrote:
You can find the relevant information in the archive of this ML. It's been discussed at least two times already.
More than two, I think; but I have seen nothing that explained the mechanism, just statements to delete vaguely-defined lines from a poorly-described file.
A page in the wiki would be nice to have. Someone has to write it.
Yes, as I said; someone who understands exactly what it is/does and how it works.
Kind regards, Stefan
Leslie -- openSUSE Leap 15.2 x86_64 Qt: 3.5.0 TDE: R14.0.9 tde-config: 1.0
On 2021/05/20 12:38 PM, J Leslie Turriff wrote:
On 2021-05-19 06:58:51 Stefan Krusche via tde-users wrote:
You can find the relevant information in the archive of this ML. It's been discussed at least two times already.
More than two, I think; but I have seen nothing that explained the mechanism, just statements to delete vaguely-defined lines from a poorly-described file.
A page in the wiki would be nice to have. Someone has to write it.
Yes, as I said; someone who understands exactly what it is/does and how it works.
Kind regards, Stefan
In brief, test9 fails if applications named kde-* are found in the TDE start menu config file. Renaming them to tde-* will remove the warning message. For more details, the ML archive definitely has more info from previous discussions.
Cheers Michele
On 2021-05-20 00:08:12 Michele Calgaro via tde-users wrote:
On 2021/05/20 12:38 PM, J Leslie Turriff wrote:
On 2021-05-19 06:58:51 Stefan Krusche via tde-users wrote:
You can find the relevant information in the archive of this ML. It's been discussed at least two times already.
More than two, I think; but I have seen nothing that explained the mechanism, just statements to delete vaguely-defined lines from a poorly-described file.
A page in the wiki would be nice to have. Someone has to write it.
Yes, as I said; someone who understands exactly what it is/does and how it works.
Kind regards, Stefan
In brief, test9 fails if applications named kde-* are found in the TDE start menu config file. Renaming them to tde-* will remove the warning message. For more details, the ML archive definitely has more info from previous discussions.
Cheers Michele
That sounds dangerous. What about KDE4 and KDE5 applications?
Leslie -- openSUSE Leap 15.2 x86_64 Qt: 3.5.0 TDE: R14.0.9 tde-config: 1.0
On 2021/05/20 02:37 PM, J Leslie Turriff wrote:
That sounds dangerous. What about KDE4 and KDE5 applications?
The test is performed only on this file "$USER_DIR/.config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu", so it will not affect other DE setup. For the other details, Stefan has already provided an excellent reply (thanks :-) )
Cheers Michele
On 2021-05-20 00:08:12 Michele Calgaro via tde-users wrote:
On 2021/05/20 12:38 PM, J Leslie Turriff wrote:
On 2021-05-19 06:58:51 Stefan Krusche via tde-users wrote:
You can find the relevant information in the archive of this ML. It's been discussed at least two times already.
More than two, I think; but I have seen nothing that explained the mechanism, just statements to delete vaguely-defined lines from a poorly-described file.
A page in the wiki would be nice to have. Someone has to write it.
Yes, as I said; someone who understands exactly what it is/does and how it works.
Kind regards, Stefan
In brief, test9 fails if applications named kde-* are found in the TDE start menu config file. Renaming them to tde-* will remove the warning message. For more details, the ML archive definitely has more info from previous discussions.
Cheers Michele
So. Really, what I'm looking for is NOT an 'in brief' explanation, but a comprehensive one. I have searched through the archive and found various instructions for 'fixing' the problem, but no explanation of what exactly this script is doing. Most of the fixes are to merely remove lines from ~/.config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu containing kde-*.desktop filenames. Okay, easy enough, but what if some of them refer to valid KDE4/5 applications? Some also say to check the contents of ~/.local/share/applications/ as well, but don't say what to do there. That directory appears to be full of *.desktop files. Maybe rename them? Delete them? But again, what then happens to KDE4/5 applications that they might refer to? (On my system there is also a ~/.trinity tree and a ~/.kde tree; do these participate in the process?) Another says to remove file /var/tmp/tdecache-$USER/r14-xdg-update-validation-test9.txt
We need some background information in order to make sense of this problem, because it keeps coming back over and over. A fix that only works until the next TDE upgrade is no fix at all, IMO. Please help us mere end-users, who aren't privy to the inner workings of the menu subsystem, to understand how all the pieces of this puzzle fit together to cause the problem.
Leslie -- openSUSE Leap 15.2 x86_64 Qt: 3.5.0 TDE: R14.0.9 tde-config: 1.0
Dear Leslie,
Am Freitag, 21. Mai 2021 schrieb J Leslie Turriff:
On 2021-05-20 00:08:12 Michele Calgaro via tde-users wrote:
On 2021/05/20 12:38 PM, J Leslie Turriff wrote:
On 2021-05-19 06:58:51 Stefan Krusche via tde-users wrote:
You can find the relevant information in the archive of this ML. It's been discussed at least two times already.
More than two, I think; but I have seen nothing that explained the mechanism, just statements to delete vaguely-defined lines from a poorly-described file.
A page in the wiki would be nice to have. Someone has to write it.
Yes, as I said; someone who understands exactly what it is/does and how it works.
Kind regards, Stefan
In brief, test9 fails if applications named kde-* are found in the TDE start menu config file. Renaming them to tde-* will remove the warning message. For more details, the ML archive definitely has more info from previous discussions.
Cheers Michele
So. Really, what I'm looking for is NOT an 'in brief' explanation, but a comprehensive one. I have searched through the archive and found various instructions for 'fixing' the problem, but no explanation of what exactly this script is doing.
The script r14-xdg-update is a shell script not so hard to understand if you regularly use shell and does exactly what has been said: test 9 looks for the string "<Filename>kde-" in the file "$USER_DIR/.config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu" and, when found, gives you the error message, please see comments below.
TEST_NUM="9" R14_UPDATE_TEST9=""
# if the file "$USER_DIR/.config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu" # exists, then… if [ -r $USER_DIR/.config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu ]; then # filter its content for lines containing the string "<Filename>kde-"… # and write the result in ${CACHE_DIR}/${SCRIPT_NAME}-validation-test${TEST_NUM}.txt # That's "/var/tmp/tdecache-$USER/r14-xdg-update-validation-test9.txt" # in this case (test9)
grep "<Filename>kde-" "$USER_DIR/.config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu"
${CACHE_DIR}/${SCRIPT_NAME}-validation-test${TEST_NUM}.txt 2>&1
# if that file is not empty, i.e. grep has found the above string, then… # nag you ;-) # if not, delete that empty file if [ -s ${CACHE_DIR}/${SCRIPT_NAME}-validation-test${TEST_NUM}.txt ]; then R14_UPDATE_TEST9="failed" MESSAGE="Some Trinity profile R14 XDG compliance updates failed. \nCheck applications-tdemenuedit.menu for '<Filename>kde-' in\n${CACHE_DIR}/${SCRIPT_NAME}-validation-test${TEST_NUM}.txt. " Validation_Failure else rm -f ${CACHE_DIR}/${SCRIPT_NAME}-validation-test${TEST_NUM}.txt 2>/dev/null fi fi
Most of the fixes are to merely remove lines from ~/.config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu containing kde-*.desktop filenames. Okay, easy enough, but what if some of them refer to valid KDE4/5 applications?
Why do you think that could be the case? IIUC the names of "$TDEHOME" have been taken care of since long. ".kde" has been taken along of KDE4/5 while for a while there had been ".kde3" for KDE3, which was renamed to ".trinity". (Reconstructed from memory. As you seem to be using OpenSuse, it might be different for you, I can't say). So, there shouldn't be any general problem.
Some also say to check the contents of ~/.local/share/applications/ as well, but don't say what to do there.
I haven't looked at it thoroughly but it looks like a bunch of tests which make sure nothing will be broken when r14-xdg-update does its job of updating your TDE user configuration.
That directory appears to be full of *.desktop files. Maybe rename them? Delete them? But again, what then happens to KDE4/5 applications that they might refer to? (On my system there is also a ~/.trinity tree and a ~/.kde tree; do these participate in the process?)
There should be no conflict. ".kde" has been reserved for KDE4 and later and been renamed to ".kde3" at first and later again to ".trinity", AFAIK.
Another says to remove file /var/tmp/tdecache-$USER/r14-xdg-update-validation-test9.txt
This is just a log file for the test #9 which tells you which obsolete lines with the string "<Filename>kde-" have been found. It tells you which lines in $USER_DIR/.config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu you could change to make the test pass or, alternatively, do what Michele said above, rename the respective files (if they exist). You can delete this log file after you are done.
We need some background information in order to make sense of this problem, because it keeps coming back over and over. A fix that only works until the next TDE upgrade is no fix at all, IMO. Please help us mere end-users, who aren't privy to the inner workings of the menu subsystem, to understand how all the pieces of this puzzle fit together to cause the problem.
I agree. I have tried to figure out how the XML stuff which structures the TDE menus etc. works. But for non-IT person it seems quite complex at first. The end user shouldn't be bothered with that at all but…
I think it is a lot of work to produce documentation a lot of which is lacking in TDE and there's only a very small team of developers who have got their hands full just to keep a huge and complex system alive and fix what can be done with limited resources.
One potential problem concerning these updates lies in the fact that it is very difficult to resolve each and every possible user configuration which frequently has derived from a taken along and migrated combination of the configurations of KDE, KDE3, KDE4/5 and TDE (as several of us have done). This seems to be so on your system, too. AIUI that's the reason why r14-xdg-update errors out and doesn't change your configuration because it can't automagically determine the background and correct solution… So that would be more work to do for developers and especially testers who report to the bug tracker and so on.
My2C
Kind regards, Stefan
On 2021-05-20 00:08:12 Michele Calgaro via tde-users wrote:
On 2021/05/20 12:38 PM, J Leslie Turriff wrote:
On 2021-05-19 06:58:51 Stefan Krusche via tde-users wrote:
You can find the relevant information in the archive of this ML. It's been discussed at least two times already.
More than two, I think; but I have seen nothing that explained the mechanism, just statements to delete vaguely-defined lines from a poorly-described file.
A page in the wiki would be nice to have. Someone has to write it.
Yes, as I said; someone who understands exactly what it is/does and how it works.
Kind regards, Stefan
In brief, test9 fails if applications named kde-* are found in the TDE start menu config file. Renaming them to tde-* will remove the warning message. For more details, the ML archive definitely has more info from previous discussions.
Cheers Michele
Attached please find a copy of /home/leslie/.config/menus/applications-tdemenuedit.menu for your review. There are an amazing number of kde-*.desktop references in here. Where did they all suddenly come from? They must not have been there before I upgraded...
Leslie -- openSUSE Leap 15.2 x86_64 Qt: 3.5.0 TDE: R14.0.9 tde-config: 1.0
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J Leslie Turriff -
Michele Calgaro -
Stefan Krusche