Okay, thanks! Before pushing to GIT I want to wait until Calvin finishes his patch for bug report 258. The check box added with this patch should be in the same group box in KControl with his patch. Darrell

On 7 April 2012 20:57, Slávek Banko <slavek.banko(a)axis.cz> wrote: Hey guys I am sorry this is taking so so very long :| I've been away at the grandparents abode in the motherlands of new england for most of this week. Tomorrow is also a big booked day. I am the in house bass player for my church and Eater morning tends to be the most stressful Sunday of the year. Hopefully I can sneak off after our easter dinner and lay the crackdown on this patch. Expect it by Friday the latest and please remember to bug me about it! Calvin

On 7 April 2012 22:34, Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote: I've read over your comments ( these conf names are the darndest confusing ambiguous buggers of all time). I will patch your patch into min, then lets push them together as one? Calvin

On 7 April 2012 22:59, Darrell Anderson <humanreadable(a)yahoo.com> wrote: I was going to stick to Logout. I think that makes the most sense. I'd even be up for changing On Login to just Login. over complications just erks me. All names should be relatively obvious what they do. If they aren't they should be obvious enough from the dialogs (except in the unfortunate cases where they were never exposed) Calvin

On Sunday 08 of April 2012 10:17:16 Darrell Anderson wrote: I agree with the "On Login" and "On Logout". But the "Feedback" I would rather turned into something else. This is how it makes me feel like a dialog box with a field where the user can enter some feedback. Slávek --

On Sunday 08 of April 2012 19:35:04 Darrell Anderson wrote: What do instead of "show" talk directly about "hide"? For example: | | Conceal logout process Slávek --

On Wednesday 11 of April 2012 02:59:30 Darrell Anderson wrote: This is difficult. "Hide logout progress dialog" would be like earlier useFancyLogout = false. While "Hide logout process" (process × progress) would be like earlier useFancyLogout = true. That's how I intended to. Slávek --

Dne st 11. dubna 2012 Darrell Anderson napsal(a): From this I would not know whether I will see the >>process<< of logout (thus closing the windows, and so on), or dialog, which it covers and does not show any >>progress<< :) Under the "progress" I understand something, where I see a progress bar. Like in the splash screen. But the dialog covering logout have no progress bar. From "progress" in the switch title, I simply confused. That's why I wanted to "progress" to get away. Slávek --

Dne st 11. dubna 2012 Darrell Anderson napsal(a): I would say that this may give the impression of a dialog box for closing session - logout, reboot, shutdown,... :) Slávek --

Dne st 11. dubna 2012 Darrell Anderson napsal(a): How about | | Show logout process simplified Slávek --

On 04/11/2012 02:43 PM, Darrell Anderson wrote: Verbosity is bad when it inflicts ambiguity. In this case I think we need need to be more verbose so we can be very specific about what we are showing. Unfortunately often I see very ambiguous settings that do not describe very well what they do. This is probably because people who are writing code are not usually technical writers or documenters. Those people would be better suited to picking names and config option titles. We need to be unambiguous, and do it by being terse. Calvin

Yes, I know. That is why I'm trying to work with you on this. The text will be translated to other languages and we have to keep that in mind. Calvin? Darrell

Dne st 11. dubna 2012 Calvin Morrison napsal(a): Yes - well - "logout status" is an excellent name for this dialog! With this name it does not conflict with the classic "logout dialog". Nice work. Variable in the configuration file should be called the same. Calvin, a pity that this proposal did not come sooner :) Slávek --

I updated the patch (attachment) in the bug report. Here is a screen grab of the current patch: http://humanreadable.nfshost.com/trinity/build_logs/shutdown.png The location should change when Calvin finishes his patch because the "Show logout status dialog" check box should be grouped with the new "Show gray fading effect" and slider controls in a new group called "On Logout". Darrell

Dne st 11. dubna 2012 Calvin Morrison napsal(a): We are stuck on two things: Show × Hide: logout status dialog does not display "anything useful" - on the contrary is a side effect of hiding Process × Progress: logout status dialogue shows no progress, just the opposite process hides. Therefore, we are still trying to find either the name for this dialog, or find the name for that process. Before you helped find a name for this dialog. Slávek --

Slavek and I are discussing the text string viewed in KControl. Basically, what do we call this dialog that appears and how do we phrase the check box text string in KControl? Currently my patch says "Show feedback dialog." The key names used in the ksmserverrc config file are more confusing. Currently there is showFancyLogout and doFancyLogout, which address two different functions. The former controls the dialog and the latter controls the gray fade effect. To avoid confusion, Calvin and I want to change the key names in ksmserverrc as well as in the code. Read the discussion in bug report 258 for details. Slavek and I want to change the text string in KControl to be understandable to most users. Calvin is adding the controls for the gray effect. The underlying code has always existed but no controls ever existed in KControl. Likewise, the underlying controls for the dialog exist but no check box in KControl. When both sets of controls are added, users need to be able to distinguish between the two. The controls Calvin is adding will have the words "gray" and "fade" in the descriptions but that leaves the other dialog to describe. Part of the problem is the dialog does not show any progress bar/thermometer. Second, although the dialog supports other text strings (read the sources), most users only see the one message of "Saving your settings...." If users saw other text strings within the dialog (which they would if they have other features enabled), then the dialog would seem less lacking. Part of the problem is words don't always translate will to other languages. Not to mention that after all of this is settled, the code calling the dialog contains a bug that prevents saving open documents (bug report 922), which demands attention before R14. The only known work-around at this time is to disable the dialog from showing, which without the check box can be performed only by editing the config file. Little things that snowball into headaches. Sometimes my head hurts.... Darrell

On 04/07/2012 07:50 PM, Darrell Anderson wrote: Darrell, Just tried building with patch and I received a KCInit error on startup - no desktop - (the main window was there, but no kicker, no desktop icons, etc..) downgraded to unpatched filed and it worked great. I don't know which patch did this, but we will need to investigate. I have saved the xsession-errors file. It will take digesting, but I did notice the new tdebase was nearly 9M larger than the last. Dunno why. I'll look more tomorrow. Let's test some more before pushing. -- David C. Rankin, J.D.,P.E.

On 04/08/2012 01:54 AM, Darrell Anderson wrote: I can't either - I hope this isn't another gcc 4.7 issue causing failures in the finished packages. But the size difference was surprising. Slow weekend for making progress. Somehow family holidays have a way of impacting the time available. I built tdebase exactly the same as I had 6 days ago and I expected the new package to be a one-for-one replacement for the current tdebase. I was quite surprised to get the desktop crash. I compressed the xsession-errors file [26k] and made it available for anyone interested here: http://www.3111skyline.com/dl/dt/tde/err/tdebase/kcminit-xsession.txt.xz -- David C. Rankin, J.D.,P.E.